That's flat out wrong. Have a look at the PDF on http://www.acma.gov.au/ Industry/Suppliers/Regulatory-arrangements/EMC- Electromagnetic-compatibility/emc-standards-list and see page 5. All IT equipment - no exceptions - must be tested (by an approved tester) to and comply with CISPR-32 and get a C-Tick for use in Australia. Upshot is don't import and use or sell the SPF modules unless the supplier has ensure it's complied. Duxtel know all about this - they supply all their Mikrotik gear (including boring old routers with no Wifi) with pretty little compliance stickers. On 9 August 2017 at 17:05, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
Agreed, the VC-231's are Tick approved, PSU and Bridge, we use a lot of them when deployed as a NTU for a VDSL2 DSLAM Implementation or as a point to point VDSL2 link.
C tick or A tick approval is only required when connecting telecommunication devices to public communication networks, C tick or A tick approval is required for radio communications devices, so if it's a telecommunications device connected to a private wire you don't need approval, if it's a radio communications device you need approval no matter what.
The ACMA make it pretty clear on their website if you aren't sure.
http://www.acma.gov.au/theACMA/bringing-communications- equipment-into-australia
Regards paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:52 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That's partly true. As it's an active device it still needs C-Tick approval for electromagnetic compatibility and susceptibility reasons. There are likely even considerations for electrical isolation as it can connect two sites on different AC phases and potentials. Considering it's pumping HF energy into a long wire it's like a radio transmitter anyway so it definitely needs to comply.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:45, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
If it's a private CAT3 cable there are no approvals required as it's just a private link.
We use the Planet VC-231 bridges for that sort of thing, they are pretty good and will do 100/100 over a couple of hundred metres with good cable.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
Yes the belt and braces and correct way is to find a version that someone has had approved for use in Australia. I don't think anyone has done that yet! It'd be nice if the manufacturer did the legwork but they only do FCC and CE.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:33, Russell Hurren <russell@zeropointnetworks.com> wrote:
I've just had a client call me and ask for a WiFi repeater to go in the house next to their motel. There's already CAT3 running between the buildings, so something like that would be a good option for me. I'd be willing to order a pair and give it a try, but I'm not sure about the legality - I presume it'd need an A-Tick approval?
I've got a CRS125 in the main building and I could put a hAP ac in the house and it'd be a nice clean option, compared to using something like a Planet VC-231.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 8:37 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That said, the http://www.proscend.com/en-gb/product/sfp/180cr.html looks interesting for linking buildings that have old CAT3 cabling in between. I reckon I could have used that sort of thing in a few places instead of wireless. Has anyone tried these sort of VDSL2 bridges?
On 26 July 2017 at 10:20, Philip Loenneker <Philip.Loenneker@tasmanet. com.au
wrote:
If anyone would care to donate a unit, I have a service I can test it on. And as an RSP, we have direct access to the NBN portal to request reactivation if it gets blocked :)
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 10:17 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
I think we're all pretty excited about the prospects of those VDSL2 and G.Fast SFP modules (I am getting FTTC so G.Fast is probably on the cards one day). I guess you can be the guinea pig and be the one to risk explaining to your ISP why your port should be unlocked. ;)
On 26 July 2017 at 10:09, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
If you plug in a modem which does not support G.vector, the port will get shut down within ~10 minutes, and requires a support request from your RSP to NBNco to have the port re-enabled. They don't specifically detect modem model and shut down if they don't know the model though, as far as I know.
IPOE on ADSL is an interesting one, that'd make setup very easy!
On 26 July 2017 at 10:05, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote:
Be careful, I remember reading that modems not tested and authorised for NBN use can cause the port to be locked. Until someone goes to the expense of having them tested and approved for use in Australia (cough .. Mike?) you may not get much joy. They might work on a bog standard ADSL line.
Speaking of which, I might be late to the party but I noticed that Telstra ADSL now supports IPoE as well as PPPoE/A. I reset an old cheapie/dodgy TPLink modem the other day for someone and without doing anything the PC connected did a DHCP request and got a public IP/DNS! When I set the modem up to do IPoE it picked all that up as well but for some reason wouldn't NAT or proxy the DNS. Wrote the modem off and we proceeded to order an NBN service.
On 26 July 2017 at 09:57, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
> Anyone else ordered one of the 180-T's yet? innet24.de are > now selling > them, but are waiting on a firmware update (due out next > week) before they're shipping more units. Looking forward to > getting one and seeing how > they go on NBN, if I can remove one device from the network > at home, I'll > be very happy! > > On 19 May 2017 at 08:08, Thomas Jackson > <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote: > > > Thanks for the responses everyone > > > > Looks like we're using the double-sided tape again this > > time around :) > > > > > > > > Sent from mobile > > > > Thomas Jackson > > Managing Director > > +61 2 8378 5555 > > > > > On 18 May 2017, at 12:54 pm, Mike Everest > > > <mike@duxtel.com> wrote: > > > > > > Hi Everyone, > > > > > > I thought I'd chip in some commentary here since there is obviously > > plenty > > > of interest :-} > > > > > > There are at least two products around that implement > > > some form of vDSL > > in > > > an SFP module, but there are lots of hurdles preventing > > > release to AU > > market > > > which are partly commercial (vendor requests significant > > > - circi > USD100K > > - > > > commitment prior to even proving viable operation on any > > > given network) > > and > > > partly technical (vDSL definition is somewhat 'loose' in implementation > > such > > > that there is no guarantee that something that works well > > > with one > vendor > > > DSLAM will also work with every other) > > > > > > At DuxTel, we've been trying to work out a solution for > > > many months, > and > > > although we are closing on a potential outcome, there is > > > no firm date > for > > > market readiness. > > > > > > One thing that we know of thus far: > > > - devices are real, and actually exist ;) > > > - devices work with MikroTik RouterOS to the extent that > > > they are > > recognised > > > by SFP drivers and 'inserted module' parameters are > > > reported correctly > > > - MikroTik are 'on board' to develop further support to > > > implement some > > form > > > of configuration interface for routerOS and this type of > > > device > > > > > > Here is what we don't have yet: > > > - commercial agreement with manufacturing vendor/s to > > > support > > development of > > > solution to work with any given vDSL service (read: NBN) > > > - compliance testing documentation to support RCM > > > eligbility for AU > > > environment > > > > > > What needs to happen before they are made available to > > > the AU market: > > > - compliance testing and certification > > > - testing (and probably some driver/firmware development) > > > to work with > > NBNCo > > > DSLAMs and other DSLAM vendors > > > > > > The big hurdle to the above is in coming to some > > > commercial agreement > > with > > > one or more vendors that satisfies their need to cover > > > costs of final > > stages > > > of development and compliance testing. > > > > > > My assessment of where this is all at is that the > > > manufacturer/s have > > > developed some 'proof of concept' hardware that seems to implement a > > general > > > form of vDSL (with ADSL fallback) BUT (and that's a big > > > BUT) there is a > > lot > > > of technical work to be done to deliver sufficient > > > confidence that they > > will > > > work reliably over any particular or general vDSL network. > > > That is not > > even > > > beginning to consider whether they are likely to meet any particular > > > regulatory compliance requirements for AU or any other jurisdiction ;) > > > > > > So short story is: they are coming, perhaps, but probably > > > not any time > > soon > > > :-J > > > > > > Questions (on or off list) are welcome! > > > > > > Cheers, Mike. > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Public mailing list > > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > mikrotik.com.au > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Public mailing list > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mi > > k rotik.com.au > > > > > > -- > > Damien Gardner Jnr > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust > rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ > -- > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the > sounds of thunder. > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world > asunder _______________________________________________ > Public mailing list > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mik rotik.com.au >
-- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. mikrotik.com.au
--
Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder
-- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mik rotik.com. au
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_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com. au
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-- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
-- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> -- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au>
Thanks for pointing that out Jason, there are lots of approvals and certifications in place in this country, when talking about communication devices, as we were specifically doing, I was referring to communication device approvals and simply quoting the ACMA themselves. You also need approvals for power packs, power boards, and just about everything else you could imagine connecting to a piece of wire somewhere, somehow, and of course wireless devices of any kind, but I wasn't referring to those. Regards Paul -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs That's flat out wrong. Have a look at the PDF on http://www.acma.gov.au/ Industry/Suppliers/Regulatory-arrangements/EMC- Electromagnetic-compatibility/emc-standards-list and see page 5. All IT equipment - no exceptions - must be tested (by an approved tester) to and comply with CISPR-32 and get a C-Tick for use in Australia. Upshot is don't import and use or sell the SPF modules unless the supplier has ensure it's complied. Duxtel know all about this - they supply all their Mikrotik gear (including boring old routers with no Wifi) with pretty little compliance stickers. On 9 August 2017 at 17:05, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
Agreed, the VC-231's are Tick approved, PSU and Bridge, we use a lot of them when deployed as a NTU for a VDSL2 DSLAM Implementation or as a point to point VDSL2 link.
C tick or A tick approval is only required when connecting telecommunication devices to public communication networks, C tick or A tick approval is required for radio communications devices, so if it's a telecommunications device connected to a private wire you don't need approval, if it's a radio communications device you need approval no matter what.
The ACMA make it pretty clear on their website if you aren't sure.
http://www.acma.gov.au/theACMA/bringing-communications- equipment-into-australia
Regards paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:52 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That's partly true. As it's an active device it still needs C-Tick approval for electromagnetic compatibility and susceptibility reasons. There are likely even considerations for electrical isolation as it can connect two sites on different AC phases and potentials. Considering it's pumping HF energy into a long wire it's like a radio transmitter anyway so it definitely needs to comply.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:45, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
If it's a private CAT3 cable there are no approvals required as it's just a private link.
We use the Planet VC-231 bridges for that sort of thing, they are pretty good and will do 100/100 over a couple of hundred metres with good cable.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
Yes the belt and braces and correct way is to find a version that someone has had approved for use in Australia. I don't think anyone has done that yet! It'd be nice if the manufacturer did the legwork but they only do FCC and CE.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:33, Russell Hurren <russell@zeropointnetworks.com> wrote:
I've just had a client call me and ask for a WiFi repeater to go in the house next to their motel. There's already CAT3 running between the buildings, so something like that would be a good option for me. I'd be willing to order a pair and give it a try, but I'm not sure about the legality - I presume it'd need an A-Tick approval?
I've got a CRS125 in the main building and I could put a hAP ac in the house and it'd be a nice clean option, compared to using something like a Planet VC-231.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 8:37 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That said, the http://www.proscend.com/en-gb/product/sfp/180cr.html looks interesting for linking buildings that have old CAT3 cabling in between. I reckon I could have used that sort of thing in a few places instead of wireless. Has anyone tried these sort of VDSL2 bridges?
On 26 July 2017 at 10:20, Philip Loenneker <Philip.Loenneker@tasmanet. com.au
wrote:
If anyone would care to donate a unit, I have a service I can test it on. And as an RSP, we have direct access to the NBN portal to request reactivation if it gets blocked :)
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 10:17 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
I think we're all pretty excited about the prospects of those VDSL2 and G.Fast SFP modules (I am getting FTTC so G.Fast is probably on the cards one day). I guess you can be the guinea pig and be the one to risk explaining to your ISP why your port should be unlocked. ;)
On 26 July 2017 at 10:09, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
If you plug in a modem which does not support G.vector, the port will get shut down within ~10 minutes, and requires a support request from your RSP to NBNco to have the port re-enabled. They don't specifically detect modem model and shut down if they don't know the model though, as far as I know.
IPOE on ADSL is an interesting one, that'd make setup very easy!
On 26 July 2017 at 10:05, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote:
Be careful, I remember reading that modems not tested and authorised for NBN use can cause the port to be locked. Until someone goes to the expense of having them tested and approved for use in Australia (cough .. Mike?) you may not get much joy. They might work on a bog standard ADSL line.
Speaking of which, I might be late to the party but I noticed that Telstra ADSL now supports IPoE as well as PPPoE/A. I reset an old cheapie/dodgy TPLink modem the other day for someone and without doing anything the PC connected did a DHCP request and got a public IP/DNS! When I set the modem up to do IPoE it picked all that up as well but for some reason wouldn't NAT or proxy the DNS. Wrote the modem off and we proceeded to order an NBN service.
On 26 July 2017 at 09:57, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
> Anyone else ordered one of the 180-T's yet? innet24.de are > now selling > them, but are waiting on a firmware update (due out next > week) before they're shipping more units. Looking forward > to getting one and seeing how > they go on NBN, if I can remove one device from the network > at home, I'll > be very happy! > > On 19 May 2017 at 08:08, Thomas Jackson > <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote: > > > Thanks for the responses everyone > > > > Looks like we're using the double-sided tape again this > > time around :) > > > > > > > > Sent from mobile > > > > Thomas Jackson > > Managing Director > > +61 2 8378 5555 > > > > > On 18 May 2017, at 12:54 pm, Mike Everest > > > <mike@duxtel.com> wrote: > > > > > > Hi Everyone, > > > > > > I thought I'd chip in some commentary here since there > > > is obviously > > plenty > > > of interest :-} > > > > > > There are at least two products around that implement > > > some form of vDSL > > in > > > an SFP module, but there are lots of hurdles preventing > > > release to AU > > market > > > which are partly commercial (vendor requests > > > significant > > > - circi > USD100K > > - > > > commitment prior to even proving viable operation on > > > any given network) > > and > > > partly technical (vDSL definition is somewhat 'loose' > > > in implementation > > such > > > that there is no guarantee that something that works > > > well with one > vendor > > > DSLAM will also work with every other) > > > > > > At DuxTel, we've been trying to work out a solution for > > > many months, > and > > > although we are closing on a potential outcome, there > > > is no firm date > for > > > market readiness. > > > > > > One thing that we know of thus far: > > > - devices are real, and actually exist ;) > > > - devices work with MikroTik RouterOS to the extent > > > that they are > > recognised > > > by SFP drivers and 'inserted module' parameters are > > > reported correctly > > > - MikroTik are 'on board' to develop further support to > > > implement some > > form > > > of configuration interface for routerOS and this type > > > of device > > > > > > Here is what we don't have yet: > > > - commercial agreement with manufacturing vendor/s to > > > support > > development of > > > solution to work with any given vDSL service (read: > > > NBN) > > > - compliance testing documentation to support RCM > > > eligbility for AU > > > environment > > > > > > What needs to happen before they are made available to > > > the AU market: > > > - compliance testing and certification > > > - testing (and probably some driver/firmware > > > development) to work with > > NBNCo > > > DSLAMs and other DSLAM vendors > > > > > > The big hurdle to the above is in coming to some > > > commercial agreement > > with > > > one or more vendors that satisfies their need to cover > > > costs of final > > stages > > > of development and compliance testing. > > > > > > My assessment of where this is all at is that the > > > manufacturer/s have > > > developed some 'proof of concept' hardware that seems > > > to implement a > > general > > > form of vDSL (with ADSL fallback) BUT (and that's a big > > > BUT) there is a > > lot > > > of technical work to be done to deliver sufficient > > > confidence that they > > will > > > work reliably over any particular or general vDSL network. > > > That is not > > even > > > beginning to consider whether they are likely to meet > > > any particular > > > regulatory compliance requirements for AU or any other jurisdiction ;) > > > > > > So short story is: they are coming, perhaps, but > > > probably not any time > > soon > > > :-J > > > > > > Questions (on or off list) are welcome! > > > > > > Cheers, Mike. > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Public mailing list > > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > mikrotik.com.au > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Public mailing list > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > > mi > > k rotik.com.au > > > > > > -- > > Damien Gardner Jnr > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust > rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ > -- > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the > sounds of thunder. > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world > asunder _______________________________________________ > Public mailing list > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mi > k rotik.com.au >
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--
Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder
-- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mik rotik.com. au
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_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com. au
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Just my 2c on this discussion ;) Current compliance mark is now 'RCM' - there is not C tick or A tick any more: 'Regulatory Compliance Mark' is a combo approach. All equipment must adhere to the relevant standards regardless of whether it is communications equipment or other - both 'intentional' and 'unintentional' RF emissions need to be tested, so it is technically immaterial whether the device is used over a private cable or not. In the end, though, you need to weigh up the risk of using uncertified equipment over potential of being taken to task for it. It *is* illegal to use non-compliant equipment, but the main questions you need to ask yourself is "who is going to prove it?", and "who is going to sue you for it?" ;-) Cheers! Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Paul Julian Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:49 PM To: jason@upandrunningtech.com.au; 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Thanks for pointing that out Jason, there are lots of approvals and certifications in place in this country, when talking about communication devices, as we were specifically doing, I was referring to communication device approvals and simply quoting the ACMA themselves.
You also need approvals for power packs, power boards, and just about everything else you could imagine connecting to a piece of wire somewhere, somehow, and of course wireless devices of any kind, but I wasn't referring to those.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
That's flat out wrong. Have a look at the PDF on http://www.acma.gov.au/ Industry/Suppliers/Regulatory-arrangements/EMC- Electromagnetic-compatibility/emc-standards-list and see page 5. All IT equipment - no exceptions - must be tested (by an approved tester) to and comply with CISPR-32 and get a C-Tick for use in Australia.
Upshot is don't import and use or sell the SPF modules unless the supplier has ensure it's complied. Duxtel know all about this - they supply all their Mikrotik gear (including boring old routers with no Wifi) with pretty little compliance stickers.
On 9 August 2017 at 17:05, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
Agreed, the VC-231's are Tick approved, PSU and Bridge, we use a lot of them when deployed as a NTU for a VDSL2 DSLAM Implementation or as a point to point VDSL2 link.
C tick or A tick approval is only required when connecting telecommunication devices to public communication networks, C tick or A tick approval is required for radio communications devices, so if it's a telecommunications device connected to a private wire you don't need approval, if it's a radio communications device you need approval no matter what.
The ACMA make it pretty clear on their website if you aren't sure.
http://www.acma.gov.au/theACMA/bringing-communications- equipment-into-australia
Regards paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:52 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That's partly true. As it's an active device it still needs C-Tick approval for electromagnetic compatibility and susceptibility reasons. There are likely even considerations for electrical isolation as it can connect two sites on different AC phases and potentials. Considering it's pumping HF energy into a long wire it's like a radio transmitter anyway so it definitely needs to comply.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:45, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
If it's a private CAT3 cable there are no approvals required as it's just a private link.
We use the Planet VC-231 bridges for that sort of thing, they are pretty good and will do 100/100 over a couple of hundred metres with good cable.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
Yes the belt and braces and correct way is to find a version that someone has had approved for use in Australia. I don't think anyone has done that yet! It'd be nice if the manufacturer did the legwork but they only do FCC and CE.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:33, Russell Hurren <russell@zeropointnetworks.com> wrote:
I've just had a client call me and ask for a WiFi repeater to go in the house next to their motel. There's already CAT3 running between the buildings, so something like that would be a good option for me. I'd be willing to order a pair and give it a try, but I'm not sure about the legality - I presume it'd need an A-Tick approval?
I've got a CRS125 in the main building and I could put a hAP ac in the house and it'd be a nice clean option, compared to using something like a Planet VC-231.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 8:37 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That said, the http://www.proscend.com/en-gb/product/sfp/180cr.html looks interesting for linking buildings that have old CAT3 cabling in between. I reckon I could have used that sort of thing in a few places instead of wireless. Has anyone tried these sort of VDSL2 bridges?
On 26 July 2017 at 10:20, Philip Loenneker <Philip.Loenneker@tasmanet. com.au
wrote:
If anyone would care to donate a unit, I have a service I can test it on. And as an RSP, we have direct access to the NBN portal to request reactivation if it gets blocked :)
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 10:17 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
I think we're all pretty excited about the prospects of those VDSL2 and G.Fast SFP modules (I am getting FTTC so G.Fast is probably on the cards one day). I guess you can be the guinea pig and be the one to risk explaining to your ISP why your port should be unlocked. ;)
On 26 July 2017 at 10:09, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
If you plug in a modem which does not support G.vector, the port will get shut down within ~10 minutes, and requires a support request from your RSP to NBNco to have the port re-enabled. They don't specifically detect modem model and shut down if they don't know the model though, as far as I know.
IPOE on ADSL is an interesting one, that'd make setup very easy!
On 26 July 2017 at 10:05, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote:
> Be careful, I remember reading that modems not tested and > authorised for NBN use can cause the port to be locked. > Until someone goes to the expense of having them tested and > approved for use in Australia (cough .. Mike?) you may not get much joy. > They might work on a bog standard ADSL line. > > Speaking of which, I might be late to the party but I noticed > that Telstra > ADSL now supports IPoE as well as PPPoE/A. I reset an old > cheapie/dodgy TPLink modem the other day for someone and > without doing anything the PC connected did a DHCP request > and got a public IP/DNS! When I set the modem up to do IPoE > it picked all that up as well but for some reason wouldn't > NAT or proxy the DNS. Wrote the modem off and we proceeded > to order an NBN service. > > On 26 July 2017 at 09:57, Damien Gardner Jnr > <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote: > > > Anyone else ordered one of the 180-T's yet? innet24.de are > > now selling > > them, but are waiting on a firmware update (due out next > > week) before they're shipping more units. Looking forward > > to getting one and seeing > how > > they go on NBN, if I can remove one device from the network > > at home, > I'll > > be very happy! > > > > On 19 May 2017 at 08:08, Thomas Jackson > > <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote: > > > > > Thanks for the responses everyone > > > > > > Looks like we're using the double-sided tape again this > > > time around :) > > > > > > > > > > > > Sent from mobile > > > > > > Thomas Jackson > > > Managing Director > > > +61 2 8378 5555 > > > > > > > On 18 May 2017, at 12:54 pm, Mike Everest > > > > <mike@duxtel.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > Hi Everyone, > > > > > > > > I thought I'd chip in some commentary here since there > > > > is obviously > > > plenty > > > > of interest :-} > > > > > > > > There are at least two products around that implement > > > > some form of > vDSL > > > in > > > > an SFP module, but there are lots of hurdles preventing > > > > release to > AU > > > market > > > > which are partly commercial (vendor requests > > > > significant > > > > - circi > > USD100K > > > - > > > > commitment prior to even proving viable operation on > > > > any given > network) > > > and > > > > partly technical (vDSL definition is somewhat 'loose' > > > > in > implementation > > > such > > > > that there is no guarantee that something that works > > > > well with one > > vendor > > > > DSLAM will also work with every other) > > > > > > > > At DuxTel, we've been trying to work out a solution for > > > > many months, > > and > > > > although we are closing on a potential outcome, there > > > > is no firm > date > > for > > > > market readiness. > > > > > > > > One thing that we know of thus far: > > > > - devices are real, and actually exist ;) > > > > - devices work with MikroTik RouterOS to the extent > > > > that they are > > > recognised > > > > by SFP drivers and 'inserted module' parameters are > > > > reported > correctly > > > > - MikroTik are 'on board' to develop further support to > > > > implement > some > > > form > > > > of configuration interface for routerOS and this type > > > > of device > > > > > > > > Here is what we don't have yet: > > > > - commercial agreement with manufacturing vendor/s to > > > > support > > > development of > > > > solution to work with any given vDSL service (read: > > > > NBN) > > > > - compliance testing documentation to support RCM > > > > eligbility for AU > > > > environment > > > > > > > > What needs to happen before they are made available to > > > > the AU > market: > > > > - compliance testing and certification > > > > - testing (and probably some driver/firmware > > > > development) to work > with > > > NBNCo > > > > DSLAMs and other DSLAM vendors > > > > > > > > The big hurdle to the above is in coming to some > > > > commercial > agreement > > > with > > > > one or more vendors that satisfies their need to cover > > > > costs of > final > > > stages > > > > of development and compliance testing. > > > > > > > > My assessment of where this is all at is that the > > > > manufacturer/s > have > > > > developed some 'proof of concept' hardware that seems > > > > to implement a > > > general > > > > form of vDSL (with ADSL fallback) BUT (and that's a big > > > > BUT) there > is a > > > lot > > > > of technical work to be done to deliver sufficient > > > > confidence that > they > > > will > > > > work reliably over any particular or general vDSL network. > > > > That is > not > > > even > > > > beginning to consider whether they are likely to meet > > > > any particular > > > > regulatory compliance requirements for AU or any other jurisdiction > ;) > > > > > > > > So short story is: they are coming, perhaps, but > > > > probably not any > time > > > soon > > > > :-J > > > > > > > > Questions (on or off list) are welcome! > > > > > > > > Cheers, Mike. > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Public mailing list > > > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > > mikrotik.com.au > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Public mailing list > > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > > > mi > > > k > rotik.com.au > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Damien Gardner Jnr > > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust > > rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ > > -- > > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the > > sounds of thunder. > > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world > > asunder _______________________________________________ > > Public mailing list > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mi > > k > rotik.com.au > > > > > > -- > <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> > _______________________________________________ > Public mailing list > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. mikrotik.com.au >
--
Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder
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Has anyone actually got their hands on one of these modules yet? I've just put in a paypal dispute with the supplier I ordered through in Germany, as it's now been six months, and they've completely stopped replying to my emails asking for a shipping date :\ On 9 August 2017 at 19:04, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Just my 2c on this discussion ;)
Current compliance mark is now 'RCM' - there is not C tick or A tick any more: 'Regulatory Compliance Mark' is a combo approach.
All equipment must adhere to the relevant standards regardless of whether it is communications equipment or other - both 'intentional' and 'unintentional' RF emissions need to be tested, so it is technically immaterial whether the device is used over a private cable or not.
In the end, though, you need to weigh up the risk of using uncertified equipment over potential of being taken to task for it. It *is* illegal to use non-compliant equipment, but the main questions you need to ask yourself is "who is going to prove it?", and "who is going to sue you for it?" ;-)
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Paul Julian Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:49 PM To: jason@upandrunningtech.com.au; 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Thanks for pointing that out Jason, there are lots of approvals and certifications in place in this country, when talking about communication devices, as we were specifically doing, I was referring to communication device approvals and simply quoting the ACMA themselves.
You also need approvals for power packs, power boards, and just about everything else you could imagine connecting to a piece of wire somewhere, somehow, and of course wireless devices of any kind, but I wasn't referring to those.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
That's flat out wrong. Have a look at the PDF on http://www.acma.gov.au/ Industry/Suppliers/Regulatory-arrangements/EMC- Electromagnetic-compatibility/emc-standards-list and see page 5. All IT equipment - no exceptions - must be tested (by an approved tester) to and comply with CISPR-32 and get a C-Tick for use in Australia.
Upshot is don't import and use or sell the SPF modules unless the supplier has ensure it's complied. Duxtel know all about this - they supply all their Mikrotik gear (including boring old routers with no Wifi) with pretty little compliance stickers.
On 9 August 2017 at 17:05, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
Agreed, the VC-231's are Tick approved, PSU and Bridge, we use a lot of them when deployed as a NTU for a VDSL2 DSLAM Implementation or as a point to point VDSL2 link.
C tick or A tick approval is only required when connecting telecommunication devices to public communication networks, C tick or A tick approval is required for radio communications devices, so if it's a telecommunications device connected to a private wire you don't need approval, if it's a radio communications device you need approval no matter what.
The ACMA make it pretty clear on their website if you aren't sure.
http://www.acma.gov.au/theACMA/bringing-communications- equipment-into-australia
Regards paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:52 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That's partly true. As it's an active device it still needs C-Tick approval for electromagnetic compatibility and susceptibility reasons. There are likely even considerations for electrical isolation as it can connect two sites on different AC phases and potentials. Considering it's pumping HF energy into a long wire it's like a radio transmitter anyway so it definitely needs to comply.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:45, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
If it's a private CAT3 cable there are no approvals required as it's just a private link.
We use the Planet VC-231 bridges for that sort of thing, they are pretty good and will do 100/100 over a couple of hundred metres with good cable.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
Yes the belt and braces and correct way is to find a version that someone has had approved for use in Australia. I don't think anyone has done that yet! It'd be nice if the manufacturer did the legwork but they only do FCC and CE.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:33, Russell Hurren <russell@zeropointnetworks.com> wrote:
I've just had a client call me and ask for a WiFi repeater to go in the house next to their motel. There's already CAT3 running between the buildings, so something like that would be a good option for me. I'd be willing to order a pair and give it a try, but I'm not sure about the legality - I presume it'd need an A-Tick approval?
I've got a CRS125 in the main building and I could put a hAP ac in the house and it'd be a nice clean option, compared to using something like a Planet VC-231.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 8:37 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That said, the http://www.proscend.com/en-gb/product/sfp/180cr.html looks interesting for linking buildings that have old CAT3 cabling in between. I reckon I could have used that sort of thing in a few places instead of wireless. Has anyone tried these sort of VDSL2 bridges?
On 26 July 2017 at 10:20, Philip Loenneker <Philip.Loenneker@tasmanet. com.au
wrote:
If anyone would care to donate a unit, I have a service I can test it on. And as an RSP, we have direct access to the NBN portal to request reactivation if it gets blocked :)
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 10:17 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
I think we're all pretty excited about the prospects of those VDSL2 and G.Fast SFP modules (I am getting FTTC so G.Fast is probably on the cards one day). I guess you can be the guinea pig and be the one to risk explaining to your ISP why your port should be unlocked. ;)
On 26 July 2017 at 10:09, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
> If you plug in a modem which does not support G.vector, the > port will get shut down within ~10 minutes, and requires a > support request from your RSP > to NBNco to have the port re-enabled. They don't specifically > detect modem > model and shut down if they don't know the model though, as > far as I know. > > IPOE on ADSL is an interesting one, that'd make setup very easy! > > On 26 July 2017 at 10:05, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) < > jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote: > >> Be careful, I remember reading that modems not tested and >> authorised for NBN use can cause the port to be locked. >> Until someone goes to the expense of having them tested and >> approved for use in Australia (cough .. Mike?) you may not get much joy. >> They might work on a bog standard ADSL line. >> >> Speaking of which, I might be late to the party but I noticed >> that Telstra >> ADSL now supports IPoE as well as PPPoE/A. I reset an old >> cheapie/dodgy TPLink modem the other day for someone and >> without doing anything the PC connected did a DHCP request >> and got a public IP/DNS! When I set the modem up to do IPoE >> it picked all that up as well but for some reason wouldn't >> NAT or proxy the DNS. Wrote the modem off and we proceeded >> to order an NBN service. >> >> On 26 July 2017 at 09:57, Damien Gardner Jnr >> <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote: >> >> > Anyone else ordered one of the 180-T's yet? innet24.de are >> > now selling >> > them, but are waiting on a firmware update (due out next >> > week) before they're shipping more units. Looking forward >> > to getting one and seeing >> how >> > they go on NBN, if I can remove one device from the network >> > at home, >> I'll >> > be very happy! >> > >> > On 19 May 2017 at 08:08, Thomas Jackson >> > <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote: >> > >> > > Thanks for the responses everyone >> > > >> > > Looks like we're using the double-sided tape again this >> > > time around :) >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Sent from mobile >> > > >> > > Thomas Jackson >> > > Managing Director >> > > +61 2 8378 5555 >> > > >> > > > On 18 May 2017, at 12:54 pm, Mike Everest >> > > > <mike@duxtel.com> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > Hi Everyone, >> > > > >> > > > I thought I'd chip in some commentary here since there >> > > > is obviously >> > > plenty >> > > > of interest :-} >> > > > >> > > > There are at least two products around that implement >> > > > some form of >> vDSL >> > > in >> > > > an SFP module, but there are lots of hurdles preventing >> > > > release to >> AU >> > > market >> > > > which are partly commercial (vendor requests >> > > > significant >> > > > - circi >> > USD100K >> > > - >> > > > commitment prior to even proving viable operation on >> > > > any given >> network) >> > > and >> > > > partly technical (vDSL definition is somewhat 'loose' >> > > > in >> implementation >> > > such >> > > > that there is no guarantee that something that works >> > > > well with one >> > vendor >> > > > DSLAM will also work with every other) >> > > > >> > > > At DuxTel, we've been trying to work out a solution for >> > > > many months, >> > and >> > > > although we are closing on a potential outcome, there >> > > > is no firm >> date >> > for >> > > > market readiness. >> > > > >> > > > One thing that we know of thus far: >> > > > - devices are real, and actually exist ;) >> > > > - devices work with MikroTik RouterOS to the extent >> > > > that they are >> > > recognised >> > > > by SFP drivers and 'inserted module' parameters are >> > > > reported >> correctly >> > > > - MikroTik are 'on board' to develop further support to >> > > > implement >> some >> > > form >> > > > of configuration interface for routerOS and this type >> > > > of device >> > > > >> > > > Here is what we don't have yet: >> > > > - commercial agreement with manufacturing vendor/s to >> > > > support >> > > development of >> > > > solution to work with any given vDSL service (read: >> > > > NBN) >> > > > - compliance testing documentation to support RCM >> > > > eligbility for AU >> > > > environment >> > > > >> > > > What needs to happen before they are made available to >> > > > the AU >> market: >> > > > - compliance testing and certification >> > > > - testing (and probably some driver/firmware >> > > > development) to work >> with >> > > NBNCo >> > > > DSLAMs and other DSLAM vendors >> > > > >> > > > The big hurdle to the above is in coming to some >> > > > commercial >> agreement >> > > with >> > > > one or more vendors that satisfies their need to cover >> > > > costs of >> final >> > > stages >> > > > of development and compliance testing. >> > > > >> > > > My assessment of where this is all at is that the >> > > > manufacturer/s >> have >> > > > developed some 'proof of concept' hardware that seems >> > > > to implement a >> > > general >> > > > form of vDSL (with ADSL fallback) BUT (and that's a big >> > > > BUT) there >> is a >> > > lot >> > > > of technical work to be done to deliver sufficient >> > > > confidence that >> they >> > > will >> > > > work reliably over any particular or general vDSL network. >> > > > That is >> not >> > > even >> > > > beginning to consider whether they are likely to meet >> > > > any particular >> > > > regulatory compliance requirements for AU or any other jurisdiction >> ;) >> > > > >> > > > So short story is: they are coming, perhaps, but >> > > > probably not any >> time >> > > soon >> > > > :-J >> > > > >> > > > Questions (on or off list) are welcome! >> > > > >> > > > Cheers, Mike. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > Public mailing list >> > > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/ mailman/listinfo/public_talk. >> > mikrotik.com.au >> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Public mailing list >> > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. >> > > mi >> > > k >> rotik.com.au >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > Damien Gardner Jnr >> > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust >> > rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ >> > -- >> > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the >> > sounds of thunder. >> > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world >> > asunder _______________________________________________ >> > Public mailing list >> > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mi >> > k >> rotik.com.au >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> >> _______________________________________________ >> Public mailing list >> Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. mikrotik.com.au >> > > > > -- > > Damien Gardner Jnr > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust > rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ > -- > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the > sounds of thunder. > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world > asunder >
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-- Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder
I've got one from Duxtel, got as far as putting it in a spare SFP port but haven't tested beyond that yet (I did notice that it gets _very_ hot even when just idle though). As an aside, has anyone found if there is some sort of an admin interface available on these? We have some links with some strange VPI/VCI settings and I'm curious how we would configure to suit that. -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Damien Gardner Jnr Sent: Friday, 1 December 2017 6:49 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs Has anyone actually got their hands on one of these modules yet? I've just put in a paypal dispute with the supplier I ordered through in Germany, as it's now been six months, and they've completely stopped replying to my emails asking for a shipping date :\ On 9 August 2017 at 19:04, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Just my 2c on this discussion ;)
Current compliance mark is now 'RCM' - there is not C tick or A tick any more: 'Regulatory Compliance Mark' is a combo approach.
All equipment must adhere to the relevant standards regardless of whether it is communications equipment or other - both 'intentional' and 'unintentional' RF emissions need to be tested, so it is technically immaterial whether the device is used over a private cable or not.
In the end, though, you need to weigh up the risk of using uncertified equipment over potential of being taken to task for it. It *is* illegal to use non-compliant equipment, but the main questions you need to ask yourself is "who is going to prove it?", and "who is going to sue you for it?" ;-)
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Paul Julian Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:49 PM To: jason@upandrunningtech.com.au; 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Thanks for pointing that out Jason, there are lots of approvals and certifications in place in this country, when talking about communication devices, as we were specifically doing, I was referring to communication device approvals and simply quoting the ACMA themselves.
You also need approvals for power packs, power boards, and just about everything else you could imagine connecting to a piece of wire somewhere, somehow, and of course wireless devices of any kind, but I wasn't referring to those.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
That's flat out wrong. Have a look at the PDF on http://www.acma.gov.au/ Industry/Suppliers/Regulatory-arrangements/EMC- Electromagnetic-compatibility/emc-standards-list and see page 5. All IT equipment - no exceptions - must be tested (by an approved tester) to and comply with CISPR-32 and get a C-Tick for use in Australia.
Upshot is don't import and use or sell the SPF modules unless the supplier has ensure it's complied. Duxtel know all about this - they supply all their Mikrotik gear (including boring old routers with no Wifi) with pretty little compliance stickers.
On 9 August 2017 at 17:05, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
Agreed, the VC-231's are Tick approved, PSU and Bridge, we use a lot of them when deployed as a NTU for a VDSL2 DSLAM Implementation or as a point to point VDSL2 link.
C tick or A tick approval is only required when connecting telecommunication devices to public communication networks, C tick or A tick approval is required for radio communications devices, so if it's a telecommunications device connected to a private wire you don't need approval, if it's a radio communications device you need approval no matter what.
The ACMA make it pretty clear on their website if you aren't sure.
http://www.acma.gov.au/theACMA/bringing-communications- equipment-into-australia
Regards paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:52 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That's partly true. As it's an active device it still needs C-Tick approval for electromagnetic compatibility and susceptibility reasons. There are likely even considerations for electrical isolation as it can connect two sites on different AC phases and potentials. Considering it's pumping HF energy into a long wire it's like a radio transmitter anyway so it definitely needs to comply.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:45, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
If it's a private CAT3 cable there are no approvals required as it's just a private link.
We use the Planet VC-231 bridges for that sort of thing, they are pretty good and will do 100/100 over a couple of hundred metres with good cable.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
Yes the belt and braces and correct way is to find a version that someone has had approved for use in Australia. I don't think anyone has done that yet! It'd be nice if the manufacturer did the legwork but they only do FCC and CE.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:33, Russell Hurren <russell@zeropointnetworks.com> wrote:
I've just had a client call me and ask for a WiFi repeater to go in the house next to their motel. There's already CAT3 running between the buildings, so something like that would be a good option for me. I'd be willing to order a pair and give it a try, but I'm not sure about the legality - I presume it'd need an A-Tick approval?
I've got a CRS125 in the main building and I could put a hAP ac in the house and it'd be a nice clean option, compared to using something like a Planet VC-231.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 8:37 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That said, the http://www.proscend.com/en-gb/product/sfp/180cr.html looks interesting for linking buildings that have old CAT3 cabling in between. I reckon I could have used that sort of thing in a few places instead of wireless. Has anyone tried these sort of VDSL2 bridges?
On 26 July 2017 at 10:20, Philip Loenneker <Philip.Loenneker@tasmanet. com.au
wrote:
If anyone would care to donate a unit, I have a service I can test it on. And as an RSP, we have direct access to the NBN portal to request reactivation if it gets blocked :)
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 10:17 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
I think we're all pretty excited about the prospects of those VDSL2 and G.Fast SFP modules (I am getting FTTC so G.Fast is probably on the cards one day). I guess you can be the guinea pig and be the one to risk explaining to your ISP why your port should be unlocked. ;)
On 26 July 2017 at 10:09, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
> If you plug in a modem which does not support G.vector, > the port will get shut down within ~10 minutes, and > requires a support request from your RSP > to NBNco to have the port re-enabled. They don't > specifically detect modem > model and shut down if they don't know the model though, > as far as I know. > > IPOE on ADSL is an interesting one, that'd make setup very easy! > > On 26 July 2017 at 10:05, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) > < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote: > >> Be careful, I remember reading that modems not tested and >> authorised for NBN use can cause the port to be locked. >> Until someone goes to the expense of having them tested >> and approved for use in Australia (cough .. Mike?) you >> may not get much joy. >> They might work on a bog standard ADSL line. >> >> Speaking of which, I might be late to the party but I >> noticed that Telstra >> ADSL now supports IPoE as well as PPPoE/A. I reset an >> old cheapie/dodgy TPLink modem the other day for someone >> and without doing anything the PC connected did a DHCP >> request and got a public IP/DNS! When I set the modem up >> to do IPoE it picked all that up as well but for some >> reason wouldn't NAT or proxy the DNS. Wrote the modem >> off and we proceeded to order an NBN service. >> >> On 26 July 2017 at 09:57, Damien Gardner Jnr >> <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote: >> >> > Anyone else ordered one of the 180-T's yet? innet24.de >> > are now selling >> > them, but are waiting on a firmware update (due out >> > next >> > week) before they're shipping more units. Looking >> > forward to getting one and seeing >> how >> > they go on NBN, if I can remove one device from the >> > network at home, >> I'll >> > be very happy! >> > >> > On 19 May 2017 at 08:08, Thomas Jackson >> > <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote: >> > >> > > Thanks for the responses everyone >> > > >> > > Looks like we're using the double-sided tape again >> > > this time around :) >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Sent from mobile >> > > >> > > Thomas Jackson >> > > Managing Director >> > > +61 2 8378 5555 >> > > >> > > > On 18 May 2017, at 12:54 pm, Mike Everest >> > > > <mike@duxtel.com> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > Hi Everyone, >> > > > >> > > > I thought I'd chip in some commentary here since >> > > > there is obviously >> > > plenty >> > > > of interest :-} >> > > > >> > > > There are at least two products around that >> > > > implement some form of >> vDSL >> > > in >> > > > an SFP module, but there are lots of hurdles >> > > > preventing release to >> AU >> > > market >> > > > which are partly commercial (vendor requests >> > > > significant >> > > > - circi >> > USD100K >> > > - >> > > > commitment prior to even proving viable operation >> > > > on any given >> network) >> > > and >> > > > partly technical (vDSL definition is somewhat 'loose' >> > > > in >> implementation >> > > such >> > > > that there is no guarantee that something that >> > > > works well with one >> > vendor >> > > > DSLAM will also work with every other) >> > > > >> > > > At DuxTel, we've been trying to work out a solution >> > > > for many months, >> > and >> > > > although we are closing on a potential outcome, >> > > > there is no firm >> date >> > for >> > > > market readiness. >> > > > >> > > > One thing that we know of thus far: >> > > > - devices are real, and actually exist ;) >> > > > - devices work with MikroTik RouterOS to the extent >> > > > that they are >> > > recognised >> > > > by SFP drivers and 'inserted module' parameters are >> > > > reported >> correctly >> > > > - MikroTik are 'on board' to develop further >> > > > support to implement >> some >> > > form >> > > > of configuration interface for routerOS and this >> > > > type of device >> > > > >> > > > Here is what we don't have yet: >> > > > - commercial agreement with manufacturing vendor/s >> > > > to support >> > > development of >> > > > solution to work with any given vDSL service (read: >> > > > NBN) >> > > > - compliance testing documentation to support RCM >> > > > eligbility for AU >> > > > environment >> > > > >> > > > What needs to happen before they are made available >> > > > to the AU >> market: >> > > > - compliance testing and certification >> > > > - testing (and probably some driver/firmware >> > > > development) to work >> with >> > > NBNCo >> > > > DSLAMs and other DSLAM vendors >> > > > >> > > > The big hurdle to the above is in coming to some >> > > > commercial >> agreement >> > > with >> > > > one or more vendors that satisfies their need to >> > > > cover costs of >> final >> > > stages >> > > > of development and compliance testing. >> > > > >> > > > My assessment of where this is all at is that the >> > > > manufacturer/s >> have >> > > > developed some 'proof of concept' hardware that >> > > > seems to implement a >> > > general >> > > > form of vDSL (with ADSL fallback) BUT (and that's a >> > > > big >> > > > BUT) there >> is a >> > > lot >> > > > of technical work to be done to deliver sufficient >> > > > confidence that >> they >> > > will >> > > > work reliably over any particular or general vDSL network. >> > > > That is >> not >> > > even >> > > > beginning to consider whether they are likely to >> > > > meet any particular >> > > > regulatory compliance requirements for AU or any >> > > > other jurisdiction >> ;) >> > > > >> > > > So short story is: they are coming, perhaps, but >> > > > probably not any >> time >> > > soon >> > > > :-J >> > > > >> > > > Questions (on or off list) are welcome! >> > > > >> > > > Cheers, Mike. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/ mailman/listinfo/public_talk. >> > mikrotik.com.au >> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Public mailing list >> > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. >> > > mi >> > > k >> rotik.com.au >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > Damien Gardner Jnr >> > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - >> > http://www.rendrag.net/ >> > -- >> > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to >> > the sounds of thunder. >> > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the >> > world asunder >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Public mailing list >> > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_tal >> > k.mi >> > k >> rotik.com.au >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> >> _______________________________________________ >> Public mailing list >> Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. mikrotik.com.au >> > > > > -- > > Damien Gardner Jnr > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - > http://www.rendrag.net/ > -- > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the > sounds of thunder. > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world > asunder >
-- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mik rotik.com. au
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au
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-- Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
How do you see the vpi/vci? It would also be great to see sync speed and rx/tx powers... On 1 Dec. 2017 8:17 am, "Thomas Jackson" <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote:
I've got one from Duxtel, got as far as putting it in a spare SFP port but haven't tested beyond that yet (I did notice that it gets _very_ hot even when just idle though).
As an aside, has anyone found if there is some sort of an admin interface available on these? We have some links with some strange VPI/VCI settings and I'm curious how we would configure to suit that.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Damien Gardner Jnr Sent: Friday, 1 December 2017 6:49 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Has anyone actually got their hands on one of these modules yet? I've just put in a paypal dispute with the supplier I ordered through in Germany, as it's now been six months, and they've completely stopped replying to my emails asking for a shipping date :\
On 9 August 2017 at 19:04, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Just my 2c on this discussion ;)
Current compliance mark is now 'RCM' - there is not C tick or A tick any more: 'Regulatory Compliance Mark' is a combo approach.
All equipment must adhere to the relevant standards regardless of whether it is communications equipment or other - both 'intentional' and 'unintentional' RF emissions need to be tested, so it is technically immaterial whether the device is used over a private cable or not.
In the end, though, you need to weigh up the risk of using uncertified equipment over potential of being taken to task for it. It *is* illegal to use non-compliant equipment, but the main questions you need to ask yourself is "who is going to prove it?", and "who is going to sue you for it?" ;-)
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Paul Julian Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:49 PM To: jason@upandrunningtech.com.au; 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Thanks for pointing that out Jason, there are lots of approvals and certifications in place in this country, when talking about communication devices, as we were specifically doing, I was referring to communication device approvals and simply quoting the ACMA themselves.
You also need approvals for power packs, power boards, and just about everything else you could imagine connecting to a piece of wire somewhere, somehow, and of course wireless devices of any kind, but I wasn't referring to those.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
That's flat out wrong. Have a look at the PDF on http://www.acma.gov.au/ Industry/Suppliers/Regulatory-arrangements/EMC- Electromagnetic-compatibility/emc-standards-list and see page 5. All IT equipment - no exceptions - must be tested (by an approved tester) to and comply with CISPR-32 and get a C-Tick for use in Australia.
Upshot is don't import and use or sell the SPF modules unless the supplier has ensure it's complied. Duxtel know all about this - they supply all their Mikrotik gear (including boring old routers with no Wifi) with pretty little compliance stickers.
On 9 August 2017 at 17:05, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
Agreed, the VC-231's are Tick approved, PSU and Bridge, we use a lot of them when deployed as a NTU for a VDSL2 DSLAM Implementation or as a point to point VDSL2 link.
C tick or A tick approval is only required when connecting telecommunication devices to public communication networks, C tick or A tick approval is required for radio communications devices, so if it's a telecommunications device connected to a private wire you don't need approval, if it's a radio communications device you need approval no matter what.
The ACMA make it pretty clear on their website if you aren't sure.
http://www.acma.gov.au/theACMA/bringing-communications- equipment-into-australia
Regards paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:52 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That's partly true. As it's an active device it still needs C-Tick approval for electromagnetic compatibility and susceptibility reasons. There are likely even considerations for electrical isolation as it can connect two sites on different AC phases and potentials. Considering it's pumping HF energy into a long wire it's like a radio transmitter anyway so it definitely needs to comply.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:45, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
If it's a private CAT3 cable there are no approvals required as it's just a private link.
We use the Planet VC-231 bridges for that sort of thing, they are pretty good and will do 100/100 over a couple of hundred metres with good cable.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
Yes the belt and braces and correct way is to find a version that someone has had approved for use in Australia. I don't think anyone has done that yet! It'd be nice if the manufacturer did the legwork but they only do FCC and CE.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:33, Russell Hurren <russell@zeropointnetworks.com> wrote:
I've just had a client call me and ask for a WiFi repeater to go in the house next to their motel. There's already CAT3 running between the buildings, so something like that would be a good option for me. I'd be willing to order a pair and give it a try, but I'm not sure about the legality - I presume it'd need an A-Tick approval?
I've got a CRS125 in the main building and I could put a hAP ac in the house and it'd be a nice clean option, compared to using something like a Planet VC-231.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 8:37 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That said, the http://www.proscend.com/en-gb/product/sfp/180cr.html looks interesting for linking buildings that have old CAT3 cabling in between. I reckon I could have used that sort of thing in a few places instead of wireless. Has anyone tried these sort of VDSL2 bridges?
On 26 July 2017 at 10:20, Philip Loenneker <Philip.Loenneker@tasmanet. com.au > wrote:
> If anyone would care to donate a unit, I have a service I > can test it on. > And as an RSP, we have direct access to the NBN portal to > request reactivation if it gets blocked :) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On > Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) > Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 10:17 AM > To: MikroTik Australia Public List > <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> > Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs > > I think we're all pretty excited about the prospects of > those > VDSL2 and G.Fast SFP modules (I am getting FTTC so G.Fast is > probably on the cards one day). I guess you can be the > guinea pig and be the one to risk explaining to your ISP why > your port should be unlocked. > ;) > > On 26 July 2017 at 10:09, Damien Gardner Jnr > <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote: > > > If you plug in a modem which does not support G.vector, > > the port will get shut down within ~10 minutes, and > > requires a support request from your > RSP > > to NBNco to have the port re-enabled. They don't > > specifically detect > modem > > model and shut down if they don't know the model though, > > as far as I > know. > > > > IPOE on ADSL is an interesting one, that'd make setup very easy! > > > > On 26 July 2017 at 10:05, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) > > < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote: > > > >> Be careful, I remember reading that modems not tested and > >> authorised for NBN use can cause the port to be locked. > >> Until someone goes to the expense of having them tested > >> and approved for use in Australia (cough .. Mike?) you > >> may not get much joy. > >> They might work on a bog standard ADSL line. > >> > >> Speaking of which, I might be late to the party but I > >> noticed that > Telstra > >> ADSL now supports IPoE as well as PPPoE/A. I reset an > >> old cheapie/dodgy TPLink modem the other day for someone > >> and without doing anything the PC connected did a DHCP > >> request and got a public IP/DNS! When I set the modem up > >> to do IPoE it picked all that up as well but for some > >> reason wouldn't NAT or proxy the DNS. Wrote the modem > >> off and we proceeded to order an NBN service. > >> > >> On 26 July 2017 at 09:57, Damien Gardner Jnr > >> <rendrag@rendrag.net> > wrote: > >> > >> > Anyone else ordered one of the 180-T's yet? innet24.de > >> > are now > selling > >> > them, but are waiting on a firmware update (due out > >> > next > >> > week) before they're shipping more units. Looking > >> > forward to getting one and > seeing > >> how > >> > they go on NBN, if I can remove one device from the > >> > network at home, > >> I'll > >> > be very happy! > >> > > >> > On 19 May 2017 at 08:08, Thomas Jackson > >> > <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote: > >> > > >> > > Thanks for the responses everyone > >> > > > >> > > Looks like we're using the double-sided tape again > >> > > this time around > :) > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > Sent from mobile > >> > > > >> > > Thomas Jackson > >> > > Managing Director > >> > > +61 2 8378 5555 > >> > > > >> > > > On 18 May 2017, at 12:54 pm, Mike Everest > >> > > > <mike@duxtel.com> > wrote: > >> > > > > >> > > > Hi Everyone, > >> > > > > >> > > > I thought I'd chip in some commentary here since > >> > > > there is > obviously > >> > > plenty > >> > > > of interest :-} > >> > > > > >> > > > There are at least two products around that > >> > > > implement some form of > >> vDSL > >> > > in > >> > > > an SFP module, but there are lots of hurdles > >> > > > preventing release to > >> AU > >> > > market > >> > > > which are partly commercial (vendor requests > >> > > > significant > >> > > > - circi > >> > USD100K > >> > > - > >> > > > commitment prior to even proving viable operation > >> > > > on any given > >> network) > >> > > and > >> > > > partly technical (vDSL definition is somewhat 'loose' > >> > > > in > >> implementation > >> > > such > >> > > > that there is no guarantee that something that > >> > > > works well with one > >> > vendor > >> > > > DSLAM will also work with every other) > >> > > > > >> > > > At DuxTel, we've been trying to work out a solution > >> > > > for many > months, > >> > and > >> > > > although we are closing on a potential outcome, > >> > > > there is no firm > >> date > >> > for > >> > > > market readiness. > >> > > > > >> > > > One thing that we know of thus far: > >> > > > - devices are real, and actually exist ;) > >> > > > - devices work with MikroTik RouterOS to the extent > >> > > > that they are > >> > > recognised > >> > > > by SFP drivers and 'inserted module' parameters are > >> > > > reported > >> correctly > >> > > > - MikroTik are 'on board' to develop further > >> > > > support to implement > >> some > >> > > form > >> > > > of configuration interface for routerOS and this > >> > > > type of device > >> > > > > >> > > > Here is what we don't have yet: > >> > > > - commercial agreement with manufacturing vendor/s > >> > > > to support > >> > > development of > >> > > > solution to work with any given vDSL service (read: > >> > > > NBN) > >> > > > - compliance testing documentation to support RCM > >> > > > eligbility for > AU > >> > > > environment > >> > > > > >> > > > What needs to happen before they are made available > >> > > > to the AU > >> market: > >> > > > - compliance testing and certification > >> > > > - testing (and probably some driver/firmware > >> > > > development) to work > >> with > >> > > NBNCo > >> > > > DSLAMs and other DSLAM vendors > >> > > > > >> > > > The big hurdle to the above is in coming to some > >> > > > commercial > >> agreement > >> > > with > >> > > > one or more vendors that satisfies their need to > >> > > > cover costs of > >> final > >> > > stages > >> > > > of development and compliance testing. > >> > > > > >> > > > My assessment of where this is all at is that the > >> > > > manufacturer/s > >> have > >> > > > developed some 'proof of concept' hardware that > >> > > > seems to > implement a > >> > > general > >> > > > form of vDSL (with ADSL fallback) BUT (and that's a > >> > > > big > >> > > > BUT) there > >> is a > >> > > lot > >> > > > of technical work to be done to deliver sufficient > >> > > > confidence that > >> they > >> > > will > >> > > > work reliably over any particular or general vDSL network. > >> > > > That > is > >> not > >> > > even > >> > > > beginning to consider whether they are likely to > >> > > > meet any > particular > >> > > > regulatory compliance requirements for AU or any > >> > > > other > jurisdiction > >> ;) > >> > > > > >> > > > So short story is: they are coming, perhaps, but > >> > > > probably not any > >> time > >> > > soon > >> > > > :-J > >> > > > > >> > > > Questions (on or off list) are welcome! > >> > > > > >> > > > Cheers, Mike. > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ > >> > > > Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > >> > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/ mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > >> > mikrotik.com.au > >> > > > >> > > _______________________________________________ > >> > > Public mailing list > >> > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > >> > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/ mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > >> > > mi > >> > > k > >> rotik.com.au > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > -- > >> > > >> > Damien Gardner Jnr > >> > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - > >> > http://www.rendrag.net/ > >> > -- > >> > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to > >> > the sounds of thunder. > >> > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the > >> > world asunder > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > Public mailing list > >> > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > >> > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_tal > >> > k.mi > >> > k > >> rotik.com.au > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Public mailing list > >> Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > >> http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > mikrotik.com.au > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Damien Gardner Jnr > > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - > > http://www.rendrag.net/ > > -- > > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the > > sounds of thunder. > > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world > > asunder > > > > > > -- > <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> > _______________________________________________ > Public mailing list > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mik rotik.com. > au >
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Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
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We have had the Duxtel one on test for about a week now, it's still working although there has been some dropped packets but we aren't sure why at this stage. Yes they run bloody hot, but it seems to be only the part that protrudes from the SFP slot. Some management options of any kind would be good, but so far it seems to work, we are yet to deploy into the field though, we will test for a few more weeks before doing that. We are looking at them from a CO more than a CPE perspective though, not for NBN connectivity. Regards Paul -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Damien Gardner Jnr Sent: Friday, 1 December 2017 6:49 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs Has anyone actually got their hands on one of these modules yet? I've just put in a paypal dispute with the supplier I ordered through in Germany, as it's now been six months, and they've completely stopped replying to my emails asking for a shipping date :\ On 9 August 2017 at 19:04, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Just my 2c on this discussion ;)
Current compliance mark is now 'RCM' - there is not C tick or A tick any more: 'Regulatory Compliance Mark' is a combo approach.
All equipment must adhere to the relevant standards regardless of whether it is communications equipment or other - both 'intentional' and 'unintentional' RF emissions need to be tested, so it is technically immaterial whether the device is used over a private cable or not.
In the end, though, you need to weigh up the risk of using uncertified equipment over potential of being taken to task for it. It *is* illegal to use non-compliant equipment, but the main questions you need to ask yourself is "who is going to prove it?", and "who is going to sue you for it?" ;-)
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Paul Julian Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:49 PM To: jason@upandrunningtech.com.au; 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Thanks for pointing that out Jason, there are lots of approvals and certifications in place in this country, when talking about communication devices, as we were specifically doing, I was referring to communication device approvals and simply quoting the ACMA themselves.
You also need approvals for power packs, power boards, and just about everything else you could imagine connecting to a piece of wire somewhere, somehow, and of course wireless devices of any kind, but I wasn't referring to those.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
That's flat out wrong. Have a look at the PDF on http://www.acma.gov.au/ Industry/Suppliers/Regulatory-arrangements/EMC- Electromagnetic-compatibility/emc-standards-list and see page 5. All IT equipment - no exceptions - must be tested (by an approved tester) to and comply with CISPR-32 and get a C-Tick for use in Australia.
Upshot is don't import and use or sell the SPF modules unless the supplier has ensure it's complied. Duxtel know all about this - they supply all their Mikrotik gear (including boring old routers with no Wifi) with pretty little compliance stickers.
On 9 August 2017 at 17:05, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
Agreed, the VC-231's are Tick approved, PSU and Bridge, we use a lot of them when deployed as a NTU for a VDSL2 DSLAM Implementation or as a point to point VDSL2 link.
C tick or A tick approval is only required when connecting telecommunication devices to public communication networks, C tick or A tick approval is required for radio communications devices, so if it's a telecommunications device connected to a private wire you don't need approval, if it's a radio communications device you need approval no matter what.
The ACMA make it pretty clear on their website if you aren't sure.
http://www.acma.gov.au/theACMA/bringing-communications- equipment-into-australia
Regards paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:52 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That's partly true. As it's an active device it still needs C-Tick approval for electromagnetic compatibility and susceptibility reasons. There are likely even considerations for electrical isolation as it can connect two sites on different AC phases and potentials. Considering it's pumping HF energy into a long wire it's like a radio transmitter anyway so it definitely needs to comply.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:45, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
If it's a private CAT3 cable there are no approvals required as it's just a private link.
We use the Planet VC-231 bridges for that sort of thing, they are pretty good and will do 100/100 over a couple of hundred metres with good cable.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
Yes the belt and braces and correct way is to find a version that someone has had approved for use in Australia. I don't think anyone has done that yet! It'd be nice if the manufacturer did the legwork but they only do FCC and CE.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:33, Russell Hurren <russell@zeropointnetworks.com> wrote:
I've just had a client call me and ask for a WiFi repeater to go in the house next to their motel. There's already CAT3 running between the buildings, so something like that would be a good option for me. I'd be willing to order a pair and give it a try, but I'm not sure about the legality - I presume it'd need an A-Tick approval?
I've got a CRS125 in the main building and I could put a hAP ac in the house and it'd be a nice clean option, compared to using something like a Planet VC-231.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 8:37 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That said, the http://www.proscend.com/en-gb/product/sfp/180cr.html looks interesting for linking buildings that have old CAT3 cabling in between. I reckon I could have used that sort of thing in a few places instead of wireless. Has anyone tried these sort of VDSL2 bridges?
On 26 July 2017 at 10:20, Philip Loenneker <Philip.Loenneker@tasmanet. com.au
wrote:
If anyone would care to donate a unit, I have a service I can test it on. And as an RSP, we have direct access to the NBN portal to request reactivation if it gets blocked :)
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 10:17 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
I think we're all pretty excited about the prospects of those VDSL2 and G.Fast SFP modules (I am getting FTTC so G.Fast is probably on the cards one day). I guess you can be the guinea pig and be the one to risk explaining to your ISP why your port should be unlocked. ;)
On 26 July 2017 at 10:09, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
> If you plug in a modem which does not support G.vector, > the port will get shut down within ~10 minutes, and > requires a support request from your RSP > to NBNco to have the port re-enabled. They don't > specifically detect modem > model and shut down if they don't know the model though, > as far as I know. > > IPOE on ADSL is an interesting one, that'd make setup very easy! > > On 26 July 2017 at 10:05, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) > < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote: > >> Be careful, I remember reading that modems not tested and >> authorised for NBN use can cause the port to be locked. >> Until someone goes to the expense of having them tested >> and approved for use in Australia (cough .. Mike?) you >> may not get much joy. >> They might work on a bog standard ADSL line. >> >> Speaking of which, I might be late to the party but I >> noticed that Telstra >> ADSL now supports IPoE as well as PPPoE/A. I reset an >> old cheapie/dodgy TPLink modem the other day for someone >> and without doing anything the PC connected did a DHCP >> request and got a public IP/DNS! When I set the modem up >> to do IPoE it picked all that up as well but for some >> reason wouldn't NAT or proxy the DNS. Wrote the modem >> off and we proceeded to order an NBN service. >> >> On 26 July 2017 at 09:57, Damien Gardner Jnr >> <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote: >> >> > Anyone else ordered one of the 180-T's yet? innet24.de >> > are now selling >> > them, but are waiting on a firmware update (due out >> > next >> > week) before they're shipping more units. Looking >> > forward to getting one and seeing >> how >> > they go on NBN, if I can remove one device from the >> > network at home, >> I'll >> > be very happy! >> > >> > On 19 May 2017 at 08:08, Thomas Jackson >> > <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote: >> > >> > > Thanks for the responses everyone >> > > >> > > Looks like we're using the double-sided tape again >> > > this time around :) >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Sent from mobile >> > > >> > > Thomas Jackson >> > > Managing Director >> > > +61 2 8378 5555 >> > > >> > > > On 18 May 2017, at 12:54 pm, Mike Everest >> > > > <mike@duxtel.com> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > Hi Everyone, >> > > > >> > > > I thought I'd chip in some commentary here since >> > > > there is obviously >> > > plenty >> > > > of interest :-} >> > > > >> > > > There are at least two products around that >> > > > implement some form of >> vDSL >> > > in >> > > > an SFP module, but there are lots of hurdles >> > > > preventing release to >> AU >> > > market >> > > > which are partly commercial (vendor requests >> > > > significant >> > > > - circi >> > USD100K >> > > - >> > > > commitment prior to even proving viable operation >> > > > on any given >> network) >> > > and >> > > > partly technical (vDSL definition is somewhat 'loose' >> > > > in >> implementation >> > > such >> > > > that there is no guarantee that something that >> > > > works well with one >> > vendor >> > > > DSLAM will also work with every other) >> > > > >> > > > At DuxTel, we've been trying to work out a solution >> > > > for many months, >> > and >> > > > although we are closing on a potential outcome, >> > > > there is no firm >> date >> > for >> > > > market readiness. >> > > > >> > > > One thing that we know of thus far: >> > > > - devices are real, and actually exist ;) >> > > > - devices work with MikroTik RouterOS to the extent >> > > > that they are >> > > recognised >> > > > by SFP drivers and 'inserted module' parameters are >> > > > reported >> correctly >> > > > - MikroTik are 'on board' to develop further >> > > > support to implement >> some >> > > form >> > > > of configuration interface for routerOS and this >> > > > type of device >> > > > >> > > > Here is what we don't have yet: >> > > > - commercial agreement with manufacturing vendor/s >> > > > to support >> > > development of >> > > > solution to work with any given vDSL service (read: >> > > > NBN) >> > > > - compliance testing documentation to support RCM >> > > > eligbility for AU >> > > > environment >> > > > >> > > > What needs to happen before they are made available >> > > > to the AU >> market: >> > > > - compliance testing and certification >> > > > - testing (and probably some driver/firmware >> > > > development) to work >> with >> > > NBNCo >> > > > DSLAMs and other DSLAM vendors >> > > > >> > > > The big hurdle to the above is in coming to some >> > > > commercial >> agreement >> > > with >> > > > one or more vendors that satisfies their need to >> > > > cover costs of >> final >> > > stages >> > > > of development and compliance testing. >> > > > >> > > > My assessment of where this is all at is that the >> > > > manufacturer/s >> have >> > > > developed some 'proof of concept' hardware that >> > > > seems to implement a >> > > general >> > > > form of vDSL (with ADSL fallback) BUT (and that's a >> > > > big >> > > > BUT) there >> is a >> > > lot >> > > > of technical work to be done to deliver sufficient >> > > > confidence that >> they >> > > will >> > > > work reliably over any particular or general vDSL network. >> > > > That is >> not >> > > even >> > > > beginning to consider whether they are likely to >> > > > meet any particular >> > > > regulatory compliance requirements for AU or any >> > > > other jurisdiction >> ;) >> > > > >> > > > So short story is: they are coming, perhaps, but >> > > > probably not any >> time >> > > soon >> > > > :-J >> > > > >> > > > Questions (on or off list) are welcome! >> > > > >> > > > Cheers, Mike. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/ mailman/listinfo/public_talk. >> > mikrotik.com.au >> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Public mailing list >> > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. >> > > mi >> > > k >> rotik.com.au >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > Damien Gardner Jnr >> > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - >> > http://www.rendrag.net/ >> > -- >> > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to >> > the sounds of thunder. >> > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the >> > world asunder >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Public mailing list >> > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_tal >> > k.mi >> > k >> rotik.com.au >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> >> _______________________________________________ >> Public mailing list >> Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. mikrotik.com.au >> > > > > -- > > Damien Gardner Jnr > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - > http://www.rendrag.net/ > -- > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the > sounds of thunder. > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world > asunder >
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-- Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
There is no admin page for the device that I've found. To set the VCI/VPI of the interface, you attach a VLAN based on the table here: https://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php?t=104109&start=50#p598656 Also you need to turn off auto negotiation and hard-set the interface to 1Gbps. -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Paul Julian Sent: Friday, 1 December 2017 8:42 AM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs We have had the Duxtel one on test for about a week now, it's still working although there has been some dropped packets but we aren't sure why at this stage. Yes they run bloody hot, but it seems to be only the part that protrudes from the SFP slot. Some management options of any kind would be good, but so far it seems to work, we are yet to deploy into the field though, we will test for a few more weeks before doing that. We are looking at them from a CO more than a CPE perspective though, not for NBN connectivity. Regards Paul -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Damien Gardner Jnr Sent: Friday, 1 December 2017 6:49 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs Has anyone actually got their hands on one of these modules yet? I've just put in a paypal dispute with the supplier I ordered through in Germany, as it's now been six months, and they've completely stopped replying to my emails asking for a shipping date :\ On 9 August 2017 at 19:04, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Just my 2c on this discussion ;)
Current compliance mark is now 'RCM' - there is not C tick or A tick any more: 'Regulatory Compliance Mark' is a combo approach.
All equipment must adhere to the relevant standards regardless of whether it is communications equipment or other - both 'intentional' and 'unintentional' RF emissions need to be tested, so it is technically immaterial whether the device is used over a private cable or not.
In the end, though, you need to weigh up the risk of using uncertified equipment over potential of being taken to task for it. It *is* illegal to use non-compliant equipment, but the main questions you need to ask yourself is "who is going to prove it?", and "who is going to sue you for it?" ;-)
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Paul Julian Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:49 PM To: jason@upandrunningtech.com.au; 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Thanks for pointing that out Jason, there are lots of approvals and certifications in place in this country, when talking about communication devices, as we were specifically doing, I was referring to communication device approvals and simply quoting the ACMA themselves.
You also need approvals for power packs, power boards, and just about everything else you could imagine connecting to a piece of wire somewhere, somehow, and of course wireless devices of any kind, but I wasn't referring to those.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
That's flat out wrong. Have a look at the PDF on http://www.acma.gov.au/ Industry/Suppliers/Regulatory-arrangements/EMC- Electromagnetic-compatibility/emc-standards-list and see page 5. All IT equipment - no exceptions - must be tested (by an approved tester) to and comply with CISPR-32 and get a C-Tick for use in Australia.
Upshot is don't import and use or sell the SPF modules unless the supplier has ensure it's complied. Duxtel know all about this - they supply all their Mikrotik gear (including boring old routers with no Wifi) with pretty little compliance stickers.
On 9 August 2017 at 17:05, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
Agreed, the VC-231's are Tick approved, PSU and Bridge, we use a lot of them when deployed as a NTU for a VDSL2 DSLAM Implementation or as a point to point VDSL2 link.
C tick or A tick approval is only required when connecting telecommunication devices to public communication networks, C tick or A tick approval is required for radio communications devices, so if it's a telecommunications device connected to a private wire you don't need approval, if it's a radio communications device you need approval no matter what.
The ACMA make it pretty clear on their website if you aren't sure.
http://www.acma.gov.au/theACMA/bringing-communications- equipment-into-australia
Regards paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:52 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That's partly true. As it's an active device it still needs C-Tick approval for electromagnetic compatibility and susceptibility reasons. There are likely even considerations for electrical isolation as it can connect two sites on different AC phases and potentials. Considering it's pumping HF energy into a long wire it's like a radio transmitter anyway so it definitely needs to comply.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:45, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
If it's a private CAT3 cable there are no approvals required as it's just a private link.
We use the Planet VC-231 bridges for that sort of thing, they are pretty good and will do 100/100 over a couple of hundred metres with good cable.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
Yes the belt and braces and correct way is to find a version that someone has had approved for use in Australia. I don't think anyone has done that yet! It'd be nice if the manufacturer did the legwork but they only do FCC and CE.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:33, Russell Hurren <russell@zeropointnetworks.com> wrote:
I've just had a client call me and ask for a WiFi repeater to go in the house next to their motel. There's already CAT3 running between the buildings, so something like that would be a good option for me. I'd be willing to order a pair and give it a try, but I'm not sure about the legality - I presume it'd need an A-Tick approval?
I've got a CRS125 in the main building and I could put a hAP ac in the house and it'd be a nice clean option, compared to using something like a Planet VC-231.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 8:37 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That said, the http://www.proscend.com/en-gb/product/sfp/180cr.html looks interesting for linking buildings that have old CAT3 cabling in between. I reckon I could have used that sort of thing in a few places instead of wireless. Has anyone tried these sort of VDSL2 bridges?
On 26 July 2017 at 10:20, Philip Loenneker <Philip.Loenneker@tasmanet. com.au
wrote:
If anyone would care to donate a unit, I have a service I can test it on. And as an RSP, we have direct access to the NBN portal to request reactivation if it gets blocked :)
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 10:17 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
I think we're all pretty excited about the prospects of those VDSL2 and G.Fast SFP modules (I am getting FTTC so G.Fast is probably on the cards one day). I guess you can be the guinea pig and be the one to risk explaining to your ISP why your port should be unlocked. ;)
On 26 July 2017 at 10:09, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
> If you plug in a modem which does not support G.vector, > the port will get shut down within ~10 minutes, and > requires a support request from your RSP > to NBNco to have the port re-enabled. They don't > specifically detect modem > model and shut down if they don't know the model though, > as far as I know. > > IPOE on ADSL is an interesting one, that'd make setup very easy! > > On 26 July 2017 at 10:05, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) > < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote: > >> Be careful, I remember reading that modems not tested and >> authorised for NBN use can cause the port to be locked. >> Until someone goes to the expense of having them tested >> and approved for use in Australia (cough .. Mike?) you >> may not get much joy. >> They might work on a bog standard ADSL line. >> >> Speaking of which, I might be late to the party but I >> noticed that Telstra >> ADSL now supports IPoE as well as PPPoE/A. I reset an >> old cheapie/dodgy TPLink modem the other day for someone >> and without doing anything the PC connected did a DHCP >> request and got a public IP/DNS! When I set the modem up >> to do IPoE it picked all that up as well but for some >> reason wouldn't NAT or proxy the DNS. Wrote the modem >> off and we proceeded to order an NBN service. >> >> On 26 July 2017 at 09:57, Damien Gardner Jnr >> <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote: >> >> > Anyone else ordered one of the 180-T's yet? innet24.de >> > are now selling >> > them, but are waiting on a firmware update (due out >> > next >> > week) before they're shipping more units. Looking >> > forward to getting one and seeing >> how >> > they go on NBN, if I can remove one device from the >> > network at home, >> I'll >> > be very happy! >> > >> > On 19 May 2017 at 08:08, Thomas Jackson >> > <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote: >> > >> > > Thanks for the responses everyone >> > > >> > > Looks like we're using the double-sided tape again >> > > this time around :) >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Sent from mobile >> > > >> > > Thomas Jackson >> > > Managing Director >> > > +61 2 8378 5555 >> > > >> > > > On 18 May 2017, at 12:54 pm, Mike Everest >> > > > <mike@duxtel.com> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > Hi Everyone, >> > > > >> > > > I thought I'd chip in some commentary here since >> > > > there is obviously >> > > plenty >> > > > of interest :-} >> > > > >> > > > There are at least two products around that >> > > > implement some form of >> vDSL >> > > in >> > > > an SFP module, but there are lots of hurdles >> > > > preventing release to >> AU >> > > market >> > > > which are partly commercial (vendor requests >> > > > significant >> > > > - circi >> > USD100K >> > > - >> > > > commitment prior to even proving viable operation >> > > > on any given >> network) >> > > and >> > > > partly technical (vDSL definition is somewhat 'loose' >> > > > in >> implementation >> > > such >> > > > that there is no guarantee that something that >> > > > works well with one >> > vendor >> > > > DSLAM will also work with every other) >> > > > >> > > > At DuxTel, we've been trying to work out a solution >> > > > for many months, >> > and >> > > > although we are closing on a potential outcome, >> > > > there is no firm >> date >> > for >> > > > market readiness. >> > > > >> > > > One thing that we know of thus far: >> > > > - devices are real, and actually exist ;) >> > > > - devices work with MikroTik RouterOS to the extent >> > > > that they are >> > > recognised >> > > > by SFP drivers and 'inserted module' parameters are >> > > > reported >> correctly >> > > > - MikroTik are 'on board' to develop further >> > > > support to implement >> some >> > > form >> > > > of configuration interface for routerOS and this >> > > > type of device >> > > > >> > > > Here is what we don't have yet: >> > > > - commercial agreement with manufacturing vendor/s >> > > > to support >> > > development of >> > > > solution to work with any given vDSL service (read: >> > > > NBN) >> > > > - compliance testing documentation to support RCM >> > > > eligbility for AU >> > > > environment >> > > > >> > > > What needs to happen before they are made available >> > > > to the AU >> market: >> > > > - compliance testing and certification >> > > > - testing (and probably some driver/firmware >> > > > development) to work >> with >> > > NBNCo >> > > > DSLAMs and other DSLAM vendors >> > > > >> > > > The big hurdle to the above is in coming to some >> > > > commercial >> agreement >> > > with >> > > > one or more vendors that satisfies their need to >> > > > cover costs of >> final >> > > stages >> > > > of development and compliance testing. >> > > > >> > > > My assessment of where this is all at is that the >> > > > manufacturer/s >> have >> > > > developed some 'proof of concept' hardware that >> > > > seems to implement a >> > > general >> > > > form of vDSL (with ADSL fallback) BUT (and that's a >> > > > big >> > > > BUT) there >> is a >> > > lot >> > > > of technical work to be done to deliver sufficient >> > > > confidence that >> they >> > > will >> > > > work reliably over any particular or general vDSL network. >> > > > That is >> not >> > > even >> > > > beginning to consider whether they are likely to >> > > > meet any particular >> > > > regulatory compliance requirements for AU or any >> > > > other jurisdiction >> ;) >> > > > >> > > > So short story is: they are coming, perhaps, but >> > > > probably not any >> time >> > > soon >> > > > :-J >> > > > >> > > > Questions (on or off list) are welcome! >> > > > >> > > > Cheers, Mike. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/ mailman/listinfo/public_talk. >> > mikrotik.com.au >> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Public mailing list >> > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. >> > > mi >> > > k >> rotik.com.au >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > Damien Gardner Jnr >> > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - >> > http://www.rendrag.net/ >> > -- >> > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to >> > the sounds of thunder. >> > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the >> > world asunder >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Public mailing list >> > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_tal >> > k.mi >> > k >> rotik.com.au >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> >> _______________________________________________ >> Public mailing list >> Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. mikrotik.com.au >> > > > > -- > > Damien Gardner Jnr > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - > http://www.rendrag.net/ > -- > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the > sounds of thunder. > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world > asunder >
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-- Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
That's a bit of a problem for us once they get RCM approval then - we've got quite a few AAPT DSL tails which use VPI 1 / VCI 34 which doesn't appear in that table :( -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Philip Loenneker Sent: Friday, 1 December 2017 9:19 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs There is no admin page for the device that I've found. To set the VCI/VPI of the interface, you attach a VLAN based on the table here: https://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php?t=104109&start=50#p598656 Also you need to turn off auto negotiation and hard-set the interface to 1Gbps. -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Paul Julian Sent: Friday, 1 December 2017 8:42 AM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs We have had the Duxtel one on test for about a week now, it's still working although there has been some dropped packets but we aren't sure why at this stage. Yes they run bloody hot, but it seems to be only the part that protrudes from the SFP slot. Some management options of any kind would be good, but so far it seems to work, we are yet to deploy into the field though, we will test for a few more weeks before doing that. We are looking at them from a CO more than a CPE perspective though, not for NBN connectivity. Regards Paul -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Damien Gardner Jnr Sent: Friday, 1 December 2017 6:49 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs Has anyone actually got their hands on one of these modules yet? I've just put in a paypal dispute with the supplier I ordered through in Germany, as it's now been six months, and they've completely stopped replying to my emails asking for a shipping date :\ On 9 August 2017 at 19:04, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Just my 2c on this discussion ;)
Current compliance mark is now 'RCM' - there is not C tick or A tick any more: 'Regulatory Compliance Mark' is a combo approach.
All equipment must adhere to the relevant standards regardless of whether it is communications equipment or other - both 'intentional' and 'unintentional' RF emissions need to be tested, so it is technically immaterial whether the device is used over a private cable or not.
In the end, though, you need to weigh up the risk of using uncertified equipment over potential of being taken to task for it. It *is* illegal to use non-compliant equipment, but the main questions you need to ask yourself is "who is going to prove it?", and "who is going to sue you for it?" ;-)
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Paul Julian Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:49 PM To: jason@upandrunningtech.com.au; 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Thanks for pointing that out Jason, there are lots of approvals and certifications in place in this country, when talking about communication devices, as we were specifically doing, I was referring to communication device approvals and simply quoting the ACMA themselves.
You also need approvals for power packs, power boards, and just about everything else you could imagine connecting to a piece of wire somewhere, somehow, and of course wireless devices of any kind, but I wasn't referring to those.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
That's flat out wrong. Have a look at the PDF on http://www.acma.gov.au/ Industry/Suppliers/Regulatory-arrangements/EMC- Electromagnetic-compatibility/emc-standards-list and see page 5. All IT equipment - no exceptions - must be tested (by an approved tester) to and comply with CISPR-32 and get a C-Tick for use in Australia.
Upshot is don't import and use or sell the SPF modules unless the supplier has ensure it's complied. Duxtel know all about this - they supply all their Mikrotik gear (including boring old routers with no Wifi) with pretty little compliance stickers.
On 9 August 2017 at 17:05, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
Agreed, the VC-231's are Tick approved, PSU and Bridge, we use a lot of them when deployed as a NTU for a VDSL2 DSLAM Implementation or as a point to point VDSL2 link.
C tick or A tick approval is only required when connecting telecommunication devices to public communication networks, C tick or A tick approval is required for radio communications devices, so if it's a telecommunications device connected to a private wire you don't need approval, if it's a radio communications device you need approval no matter what.
The ACMA make it pretty clear on their website if you aren't sure.
http://www.acma.gov.au/theACMA/bringing-communications- equipment-into-australia
Regards paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:52 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That's partly true. As it's an active device it still needs C-Tick approval for electromagnetic compatibility and susceptibility reasons. There are likely even considerations for electrical isolation as it can connect two sites on different AC phases and potentials. Considering it's pumping HF energy into a long wire it's like a radio transmitter anyway so it definitely needs to comply.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:45, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
If it's a private CAT3 cable there are no approvals required as it's just a private link.
We use the Planet VC-231 bridges for that sort of thing, they are pretty good and will do 100/100 over a couple of hundred metres with good cable.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
Yes the belt and braces and correct way is to find a version that someone has had approved for use in Australia. I don't think anyone has done that yet! It'd be nice if the manufacturer did the legwork but they only do FCC and CE.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:33, Russell Hurren <russell@zeropointnetworks.com> wrote:
I've just had a client call me and ask for a WiFi repeater to go in the house next to their motel. There's already CAT3 running between the buildings, so something like that would be a good option for me. I'd be willing to order a pair and give it a try, but I'm not sure about the legality - I presume it'd need an A-Tick approval?
I've got a CRS125 in the main building and I could put a hAP ac in the house and it'd be a nice clean option, compared to using something like a Planet VC-231.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 8:37 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That said, the http://www.proscend.com/en-gb/product/sfp/180cr.html looks interesting for linking buildings that have old CAT3 cabling in between. I reckon I could have used that sort of thing in a few places instead of wireless. Has anyone tried these sort of VDSL2 bridges?
On 26 July 2017 at 10:20, Philip Loenneker <Philip.Loenneker@tasmanet. com.au
wrote:
If anyone would care to donate a unit, I have a service I can test it on. And as an RSP, we have direct access to the NBN portal to request reactivation if it gets blocked :)
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 10:17 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
I think we're all pretty excited about the prospects of those VDSL2 and G.Fast SFP modules (I am getting FTTC so G.Fast is probably on the cards one day). I guess you can be the guinea pig and be the one to risk explaining to your ISP why your port should be unlocked. ;)
On 26 July 2017 at 10:09, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
> If you plug in a modem which does not support G.vector, > the port will get shut down within ~10 minutes, and > requires a support request from your RSP > to NBNco to have the port re-enabled. They don't > specifically detect modem > model and shut down if they don't know the model though, > as far as I know. > > IPOE on ADSL is an interesting one, that'd make setup very easy! > > On 26 July 2017 at 10:05, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) > < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote: > >> Be careful, I remember reading that modems not tested and >> authorised for NBN use can cause the port to be locked. >> Until someone goes to the expense of having them tested >> and approved for use in Australia (cough .. Mike?) you >> may not get much joy. >> They might work on a bog standard ADSL line. >> >> Speaking of which, I might be late to the party but I >> noticed that Telstra >> ADSL now supports IPoE as well as PPPoE/A. I reset an >> old cheapie/dodgy TPLink modem the other day for someone >> and without doing anything the PC connected did a DHCP >> request and got a public IP/DNS! When I set the modem up >> to do IPoE it picked all that up as well but for some >> reason wouldn't NAT or proxy the DNS. Wrote the modem >> off and we proceeded to order an NBN service. >> >> On 26 July 2017 at 09:57, Damien Gardner Jnr >> <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote: >> >> > Anyone else ordered one of the 180-T's yet? innet24.de >> > are now selling >> > them, but are waiting on a firmware update (due out >> > next >> > week) before they're shipping more units. Looking >> > forward to getting one and seeing >> how >> > they go on NBN, if I can remove one device from the >> > network at home, >> I'll >> > be very happy! >> > >> > On 19 May 2017 at 08:08, Thomas Jackson >> > <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote: >> > >> > > Thanks for the responses everyone >> > > >> > > Looks like we're using the double-sided tape again >> > > this time around :) >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Sent from mobile >> > > >> > > Thomas Jackson >> > > Managing Director >> > > +61 2 8378 5555 >> > > >> > > > On 18 May 2017, at 12:54 pm, Mike Everest >> > > > <mike@duxtel.com> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > Hi Everyone, >> > > > >> > > > I thought I'd chip in some commentary here since >> > > > there is obviously >> > > plenty >> > > > of interest :-} >> > > > >> > > > There are at least two products around that >> > > > implement some form of >> vDSL >> > > in >> > > > an SFP module, but there are lots of hurdles >> > > > preventing release to >> AU >> > > market >> > > > which are partly commercial (vendor requests >> > > > significant >> > > > - circi >> > USD100K >> > > - >> > > > commitment prior to even proving viable operation >> > > > on any given >> network) >> > > and >> > > > partly technical (vDSL definition is somewhat 'loose' >> > > > in >> implementation >> > > such >> > > > that there is no guarantee that something that >> > > > works well with one >> > vendor >> > > > DSLAM will also work with every other) >> > > > >> > > > At DuxTel, we've been trying to work out a solution >> > > > for many months, >> > and >> > > > although we are closing on a potential outcome, >> > > > there is no firm >> date >> > for >> > > > market readiness. >> > > > >> > > > One thing that we know of thus far: >> > > > - devices are real, and actually exist ;) >> > > > - devices work with MikroTik RouterOS to the extent >> > > > that they are >> > > recognised >> > > > by SFP drivers and 'inserted module' parameters are >> > > > reported >> correctly >> > > > - MikroTik are 'on board' to develop further >> > > > support to implement >> some >> > > form >> > > > of configuration interface for routerOS and this >> > > > type of device >> > > > >> > > > Here is what we don't have yet: >> > > > - commercial agreement with manufacturing vendor/s >> > > > to support >> > > development of >> > > > solution to work with any given vDSL service (read: >> > > > NBN) >> > > > - compliance testing documentation to support RCM >> > > > eligbility for AU >> > > > environment >> > > > >> > > > What needs to happen before they are made available >> > > > to the AU >> market: >> > > > - compliance testing and certification >> > > > - testing (and probably some driver/firmware >> > > > development) to work >> with >> > > NBNCo >> > > > DSLAMs and other DSLAM vendors >> > > > >> > > > The big hurdle to the above is in coming to some >> > > > commercial >> agreement >> > > with >> > > > one or more vendors that satisfies their need to >> > > > cover costs of >> final >> > > stages >> > > > of development and compliance testing. >> > > > >> > > > My assessment of where this is all at is that the >> > > > manufacturer/s >> have >> > > > developed some 'proof of concept' hardware that >> > > > seems to implement a >> > > general >> > > > form of vDSL (with ADSL fallback) BUT (and that's a >> > > > big >> > > > BUT) there >> is a >> > > lot >> > > > of technical work to be done to deliver sufficient >> > > > confidence that >> they >> > > will >> > > > work reliably over any particular or general vDSL network. >> > > > That is >> not >> > > even >> > > > beginning to consider whether they are likely to >> > > > meet any particular >> > > > regulatory compliance requirements for AU or any >> > > > other jurisdiction >> ;) >> > > > >> > > > So short story is: they are coming, perhaps, but >> > > > probably not any >> time >> > > soon >> > > > :-J >> > > > >> > > > Questions (on or off list) are welcome! >> > > > >> > > > Cheers, Mike. >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/ mailman/listinfo/public_talk. >> > mikrotik.com.au >> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Public mailing list >> > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. >> > > mi >> > > k >> rotik.com.au >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > Damien Gardner Jnr >> > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - >> > http://www.rendrag.net/ >> > -- >> > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to >> > the sounds of thunder. >> > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the >> > world asunder >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Public mailing list >> > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_tal >> > k.mi >> > k >> rotik.com.au >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> >> _______________________________________________ >> Public mailing list >> Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au >> http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. mikrotik.com.au >> > > > > -- > > Damien Gardner Jnr > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - > http://www.rendrag.net/ > -- > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the > sounds of thunder. > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world > asunder >
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-- Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Damien Gardner Jnr Sent: Friday, 1 December 2017 6:49 AM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Has anyone actually got their hands on one of these modules yet? I've just put in a paypal dispute with the supplier I ordered through in Germany, as it's now been six months, and they've completely stopped replying to my emails asking for a shipping date :\
On 9 August 2017 at 19:04, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Just my 2c on this discussion ;)
Current compliance mark is now 'RCM' - there is not C tick or A tick any more: 'Regulatory Compliance Mark' is a combo approach.
All equipment must adhere to the relevant standards regardless of whether it is communications equipment or other - both 'intentional' and 'unintentional' RF emissions need to be tested, so it is technically immaterial whether the device is used over a private cable or not.
In the end, though, you need to weigh up the risk of using uncertified equipment over potential of being taken to task for it. It *is* illegal to use non-compliant equipment, but the main questions you need to ask yourself is "who is going to prove it?", and "who is going to sue you for it?" ;-)
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Paul Julian Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:49 PM To: jason@upandrunningtech.com.au; 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Thanks for pointing that out Jason, there are lots of approvals and certifications in place in this country, when talking about communication devices, as we were specifically doing, I was referring to communication device approvals and simply quoting the ACMA themselves.
You also need approvals for power packs, power boards, and just about everything else you could imagine connecting to a piece of wire somewhere, somehow, and of course wireless devices of any kind, but I wasn't referring to those.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 5:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
That's flat out wrong. Have a look at the PDF on http://www.acma.gov.au/ Industry/Suppliers/Regulatory-arrangements/EMC- Electromagnetic-compatibility/emc-standards-list and see page 5. All IT equipment - no exceptions - must be tested (by an approved tester) to and comply with CISPR-32 and get a C-Tick for use in Australia.
Upshot is don't import and use or sell the SPF modules unless the supplier has ensure it's complied. Duxtel know all about this - they supply all their Mikrotik gear (including boring old routers with no Wifi) with pretty little compliance stickers.
On 9 August 2017 at 17:05, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
Agreed, the VC-231's are Tick approved, PSU and Bridge, we use a lot of them when deployed as a NTU for a VDSL2 DSLAM Implementation or as a point to point VDSL2 link.
C tick or A tick approval is only required when connecting telecommunication devices to public communication networks, C tick or A tick approval is required for radio communications devices, so if it's a telecommunications device connected to a private wire you don't need approval, if it's a radio communications device you need approval no matter what.
The ACMA make it pretty clear on their website if you aren't sure.
http://www.acma.gov.au/theACMA/bringing-communications- equipment-into-australia
Regards paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:52 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That's partly true. As it's an active device it still needs C-Tick approval for electromagnetic compatibility and susceptibility reasons. There are likely even considerations for electrical isolation as it can connect two sites on different AC phases and potentials. Considering it's pumping HF energy into a long wire it's like a radio transmitter anyway so it definitely needs to comply.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:45, Paul Julian <paul@oxygennetworks.com.au> wrote:
If it's a private CAT3 cable there are no approvals required as it's just a private link.
We use the Planet VC-231 bridges for that sort of thing, they are pretty good and will do 100/100 over a couple of hundred metres with good cable.
Regards Paul
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 9 August 2017 4:41 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
Yes the belt and braces and correct way is to find a version that someone has had approved for use in Australia. I don't think anyone has done that yet! It'd be nice if the manufacturer did the legwork but they only do FCC and CE.
On 9 August 2017 at 16:33, Russell Hurren <russell@zeropointnetworks.com> wrote:
I've just had a client call me and ask for a WiFi repeater to go in the house next to their motel. There's already CAT3 running between the buildings, so something like that would be a good option for me. I'd be willing to order a pair and give it a try, but I'm not sure about the legality - I presume it'd need an A-Tick approval?
I've got a CRS125 in the main building and I could put a hAP ac in the house and it'd be a nice clean option, compared to using something like a Planet VC-231.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 8:37 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs
That said, the http://www.proscend.com/en-gb/product/sfp/180cr.html looks interesting for linking buildings that have old CAT3 cabling in between. I reckon I could have used that sort of thing in a few places instead of wireless. Has anyone tried these sort of VDSL2 bridges?
On 26 July 2017 at 10:20, Philip Loenneker <Philip.Loenneker@tasmanet. com.au > wrote:
> If anyone would care to donate a unit, I have a service I > can test it on. > And as an RSP, we have direct access to the NBN portal to > request reactivation if it gets blocked :) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On > Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) > Sent: Wednesday, 26 July 2017 10:17 AM > To: MikroTik Australia Public List > <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> > Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] xDSL SFPs > > I think we're all pretty excited about the prospects of > those > VDSL2 and G.Fast SFP modules (I am getting FTTC so G.Fast is > probably on the cards one day). I guess you can be the > guinea pig and be the one to risk explaining to your ISP why > your port should be unlocked. > ;) > > On 26 July 2017 at 10:09, Damien Gardner Jnr > <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote: > > > If you plug in a modem which does not support G.vector, > > the port will get shut down within ~10 minutes, and > > requires a support request from your > RSP > > to NBNco to have the port re-enabled. They don't > > specifically detect > modem > > model and shut down if they don't know the model though, > > as far as I > know. > > > > IPOE on ADSL is an interesting one, that'd make setup very easy! > > > > On 26 July 2017 at 10:05, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) > > < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote: > > > >> Be careful, I remember reading that modems not tested and > >> authorised for NBN use can cause the port to be locked. > >> Until someone goes to the expense of having them tested > >> and approved for use in Australia (cough .. Mike?) you > >> may not get much joy. > >> They might work on a bog standard ADSL line. > >> > >> Speaking of which, I might be late to the party but I > >> noticed that > Telstra > >> ADSL now supports IPoE as well as PPPoE/A. I reset an > >> old cheapie/dodgy TPLink modem the other day for someone > >> and without doing anything the PC connected did a DHCP > >> request and got a public IP/DNS! When I set the modem up > >> to do IPoE it picked all that up as well but for some > >> reason wouldn't NAT or proxy the DNS. Wrote the modem > >> off and we proceeded to order an NBN service. > >> > >> On 26 July 2017 at 09:57, Damien Gardner Jnr > >> <rendrag@rendrag.net> > wrote: > >> > >> > Anyone else ordered one of the 180-T's yet? innet24.de > >> > are now > selling > >> > them, but are waiting on a firmware update (due out > >> > next > >> > week) before they're shipping more units. Looking > >> > forward to getting one and > seeing > >> how > >> > they go on NBN, if I can remove one device from the > >> > network at home, > >> I'll > >> > be very happy! > >> > > >> > On 19 May 2017 at 08:08, Thomas Jackson > >> > <thomas@thomax.com.au> wrote: > >> > > >> > > Thanks for the responses everyone > >> > > > >> > > Looks like we're using the double-sided tape again > >> > > this time around > :) > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > Sent from mobile > >> > > > >> > > Thomas Jackson > >> > > Managing Director > >> > > +61 2 8378 5555 > >> > > > >> > > > On 18 May 2017, at 12:54 pm, Mike Everest > >> > > > <mike@duxtel.com> > wrote: > >> > > > > >> > > > Hi Everyone, > >> > > > > >> > > > I thought I'd chip in some commentary here since > >> > > > there is > obviously > >> > > plenty > >> > > > of interest :-} > >> > > > > >> > > > There are at least two products around that > >> > > > implement some form of > >> vDSL > >> > > in > >> > > > an SFP module, but there are lots of hurdles > >> > > > preventing release to > >> AU > >> > > market > >> > > > which are partly commercial (vendor requests > >> > > > significant > >> > > > - circi > >> > USD100K > >> > > - > >> > > > commitment prior to even proving viable operation > >> > > > on any given > >> network) > >> > > and > >> > > > partly technical (vDSL definition is somewhat 'loose' > >> > > > in > >> implementation > >> > > such > >> > > > that there is no guarantee that something that > >> > > > works well with one > >> > vendor > >> > > > DSLAM will also work with every other) > >> > > > > >> > > > At DuxTel, we've been trying to work out a solution > >> > > > for many > months, > >> > and > >> > > > although we are closing on a potential outcome, > >> > > > there is no firm > >> date > >> > for > >> > > > market readiness. > >> > > > > >> > > > One thing that we know of thus far: > >> > > > - devices are real, and actually exist ;) > >> > > > - devices work with MikroTik RouterOS to the extent > >> > > > that they are > >> > > recognised > >> > > > by SFP drivers and 'inserted module' parameters are > >> > > > reported > >> correctly > >> > > > - MikroTik are 'on board' to develop further > >> > > > support to implement > >> some > >> > > form > >> > > > of configuration interface for routerOS and this > >> > > > type of device > >> > > > > >> > > > Here is what we don't have yet: > >> > > > - commercial agreement with manufacturing vendor/s > >> > > > to support > >> > > development of > >> > > > solution to work with any given vDSL service (read: > >> > > > NBN) > >> > > > - compliance testing documentation to support RCM > >> > > > eligbility for > AU > >> > > > environment > >> > > > > >> > > > What needs to happen before they are made available > >> > > > to the AU > >> market: > >> > > > - compliance testing and certification > >> > > > - testing (and probably some driver/firmware > >> > > > development) to work > >> with > >> > > NBNCo > >> > > > DSLAMs and other DSLAM vendors > >> > > > > >> > > > The big hurdle to the above is in coming to some > >> > > > commercial > >> agreement > >> > > with > >> > > > one or more vendors that satisfies their need to > >> > > > cover costs of > >> final > >> > > stages > >> > > > of development and compliance testing. > >> > > > > >> > > > My assessment of where this is all at is that the > >> > > > manufacturer/s > >> have > >> > > > developed some 'proof of concept' hardware that > >> > > > seems to > implement a > >> > > general > >> > > > form of vDSL (with ADSL fallback) BUT (and that's a > >> > > > big > >> > > > BUT) there > >> is a > >> > > lot > >> > > > of technical work to be done to deliver sufficient > >> > > > confidence that > >> they > >> > > will > >> > > > work reliably over any particular or general vDSL network. > >> > > > That > is > >> not > >> > > even > >> > > > beginning to consider whether they are likely to > >> > > > meet any > particular > >> > > > regulatory compliance requirements for AU or any > >> > > > other > jurisdiction > >> ;) > >> > > > > >> > > > So short story is: they are coming, perhaps, but > >> > > > probably not any > >> time > >> > > soon > >> > > > :-J > >> > > > > >> > > > Questions (on or off list) are welcome! > >> > > > > >> > > > Cheers, Mike. > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ > >> > > > Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > >> > > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/ mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > >> > mikrotik.com.au > >> > > > >> > > _______________________________________________ > >> > > Public mailing list > >> > > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > >> > > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > >> > > mi > >> > > k > >> rotik.com.au > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > -- > >> > > >> > Damien Gardner Jnr > >> > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - > >> > http://www.rendrag.net/ > >> > -- > >> > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to > >> > the sounds of thunder. > >> > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the > >> > world asunder > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > Public mailing list > >> > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > >> > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_tal > >> > k.mi > >> > k > >> rotik.com.au > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Public mailing list > >> Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > >> http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. > mikrotik.com.au > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Damien Gardner Jnr > > VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - > > http://www.rendrag.net/ > > -- > > We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the > > sounds of thunder. > > We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world > > asunder > > > > > > -- > <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> > _______________________________________________ > Public mailing list > Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au > http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mik rotik.com. > au >
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Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of
Hi Damien, They have probably been stung by the same problem as us - manufacturer has taken our order and offered an initial dispatch date of October 25, then revised to November 25, and now revised to January 4! :-( Like that German company you mention, we've been taking advance orders based on indicative availability dates by the manufacturer, but they just keep pushing the dates along. There has been no official advice at all of what could be causing the delays, but I suspect it is not about actual production, and quite possibly commercial wrangling... You are welcome to put in an order with us, if you want to - there is no payment required until goods become available, and no obligation to proceed if your needs change in the meantime! :-} Cheers! Mike. thunder.
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Interesting development, the whole FTTC thing will have an NBN supplied termination device/modem/bridge which will do reverse power, VDSL2 and G.FAST and have an ethernet port to plug your RB3011 into. So these nifty Proscend 180T modules won't be useful for anything other than FTTN when approved. Which should be RSN, right? :) http://www.zdnet.com/article/netcomm-wireless-unveils-fttc-network-connectio...
Yes, There is also 'FTTB' model which will be predominantly vDSL too I think, Cheers! Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 6 December 2017 6:34 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Interesting development, the whole FTTC thing will have an NBN supplied termination device/modem/bridge which will do reverse power, VDSL2 and G.FAST and have an ethernet port to plug your RB3011 into. So these nifty Proscend 180T modules won't be useful for anything other than FTTN when approved. Which should be RSN, right? :)
http://www.zdnet.com/article/netcomm-wireless-unveils-fttc-network- connection-device/ _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
How's approvals going for the 180T? Is the end of Dec. estimate going to hold? I am itchin' to use mine on the NBN. On 7 December 2017 at 16:40, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Yes,
There is also 'FTTB' model which will be predominantly vDSL too I think,
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 6 December 2017 6:34 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Interesting development, the whole FTTC thing will have an NBN supplied termination device/modem/bridge which will do reverse power, VDSL2 and G.FAST and have an ethernet port to plug your RB3011 into. So these nifty Proscend 180T modules won't be useful for anything other than FTTN when approved. Which should be RSN, right? :)
http://www.zdnet.com/article/netcomm-wireless-unveils-fttc-network- connection-device/ _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
Unfortunately, the manufacturer (metanoia) is so far being unhelpful in facilitating the lab testing. In short, specific lab tests require configuration of the modem to a specific state but due to lack on any interface to the modem itself the only way to do it is to re-flash the unit with a new 'profile'. Manufacturer keep saying that they will provide such profile, but so far have not come up with the goods with excuses like "we are concentrating on <insert some priority project> at the moment" Until we get their support on this, testing is going absolutely nowhere :-( Very frustrating and infuriating. Cheers, Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Saturday, 16 December 2017 7:17 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
How's approvals going for the 180T? Is the end of Dec. estimate going to hold? I am itchin' to use mine on the NBN.
On 7 December 2017 at 16:40, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Yes,
There is also 'FTTB' model which will be predominantly vDSL too I think,
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 6 December 2017 6:34 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Interesting development, the whole FTTC thing will have an NBN supplied termination device/modem/bridge which will do reverse power, VDSL2 and G.FAST and have an ethernet port to plug your RB3011 into. So these nifty Proscend 180T modules won't be useful for anything other than FTTN when approved. Which should be RSN, right? :)
http://www.zdnet.com/article/netcomm-wireless-unveils-fttc-network- connection-device/ _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.co m.au
-- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
It seems weird that they wouldn’t either provide a simple configuration interface, or provide the firmware to do the tests that are needed to get nbn approval - they’re going to sell a metric shit-tonne of the units if they get nbn approval?!? On Sun, 17 Dec 2017 at 10:39 am, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Unfortunately, the manufacturer (metanoia) is so far being unhelpful in facilitating the lab testing.
In short, specific lab tests require configuration of the modem to a specific state but due to lack on any interface to the modem itself the only way to do it is to re-flash the unit with a new 'profile'. Manufacturer keep saying that they will provide such profile, but so far have not come up with the goods with excuses like "we are concentrating on <insert some priority project> at the moment"
Until we get their support on this, testing is going absolutely nowhere :-(
Very frustrating and infuriating.
Cheers, Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Saturday, 16 December 2017 7:17 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
How's approvals going for the 180T? Is the end of Dec. estimate going to hold? I am itchin' to use mine on the NBN.
On 7 December 2017 at 16:40, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Yes,
There is also 'FTTB' model which will be predominantly vDSL too I think,
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 6 December 2017 6:34 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Interesting development, the whole FTTC thing will have an NBN supplied termination device/modem/bridge which will do reverse power, VDSL2 and G.FAST and have an ethernet port to plug your RB3011 into. So these nifty Proscend 180T modules won't be useful for anything other than FTTN when approved. Which should be RSN, right? :)
http://www.zdnet.com/article/netcomm-wireless-unveils-fttc-network- connection-device/ _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.co m.au
-- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
-- Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder
Hmmm, both the Proscend models have disappeared off the Duxtel shop. What's going on? On 17 December 2017 at 10:50, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
It seems weird that they wouldn’t either provide a simple configuration interface, or provide the firmware to do the tests that are needed to get nbn approval - they’re going to sell a metric shit-tonne of the units if they get nbn approval?!?
On Sun, 17 Dec 2017 at 10:39 am, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Unfortunately, the manufacturer (metanoia) is so far being unhelpful in facilitating the lab testing.
In short, specific lab tests require configuration of the modem to a specific state but due to lack on any interface to the modem itself the only way to do it is to re-flash the unit with a new 'profile'. Manufacturer keep saying that they will provide such profile, but so far have not come up with the goods with excuses like "we are concentrating on <insert some priority project> at the moment"
Until we get their support on this, testing is going absolutely nowhere :-(
Very frustrating and infuriating.
Cheers, Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Saturday, 16 December 2017 7:17 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
How's approvals going for the 180T? Is the end of Dec. estimate going to hold? I am itchin' to use mine on the NBN.
On 7 December 2017 at 16:40, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Yes,
There is also 'FTTB' model which will be predominantly vDSL too I think,
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 6 December 2017 6:34 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Interesting development, the whole FTTC thing will have an NBN supplied termination device/modem/bridge which will do reverse power, VDSL2 and G.FAST and have an ethernet port to plug your RB3011 into. So these nifty Proscend 180T modules won't be useful for anything other than FTTN when approved. Which should be RSN, right? :)
http://www.zdnet.com/article/netcomm-wireless-unveils-fttc-network- connection-device/ _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. mikrotik.co m.au
-- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk. mikrotik.com.au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
--
Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder
If anyone is interested I have an unused Proscend 180T (from Duxtel originally) for sale. Contact me off list. On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 at 11:03, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote:
Hmmm, both the Proscend models have disappeared off the Duxtel shop. What's going on?
On 17 December 2017 at 10:50, Damien Gardner Jnr <rendrag@rendrag.net> wrote:
It seems weird that they wouldn’t either provide a simple configuration interface, or provide the firmware to do the tests that are needed to get nbn approval - they’re going to sell a metric shit-tonne of the units if they get nbn approval?!?
On Sun, 17 Dec 2017 at 10:39 am, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Unfortunately, the manufacturer (metanoia) is so far being unhelpful in facilitating the lab testing.
In short, specific lab tests require configuration of the modem to a specific state but due to lack on any interface to the modem itself the only way to do it is to re-flash the unit with a new 'profile'. Manufacturer keep saying that they will provide such profile, but so far have not come up with the goods with excuses like "we are concentrating on <insert some priority project> at the moment"
Until we get their support on this, testing is going absolutely nowhere :-(
Very frustrating and infuriating.
Cheers, Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Saturday, 16 December 2017 7:17 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
How's approvals going for the 180T? Is the end of Dec. estimate going to hold? I am itchin' to use mine on the NBN.
On 7 December 2017 at 16:40, Mike Everest <mike@duxtel.com> wrote:
Yes,
There is also 'FTTB' model which will be predominantly vDSL too I think,
Cheers!
Mike.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) Sent: Wednesday, 6 December 2017 6:34 PM To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Fwd: xDSL SFPs
Interesting development, the whole FTTC thing will have an NBN supplied termination device/modem/bridge which will do reverse power, VDSL2 and G.FAST and have an ethernet port to plug your RB3011 into. So these nifty Proscend 180T modules won't be useful for anything other than FTTN when approved. Which should be RSN, right? :)
http://www.zdnet.com/article/netcomm-wireless-unveils-fttc-network-
connection-device/ _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au
http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.co
m.au
-- <https://www.upandrunningtech.com.au> _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au
http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
--
Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder
On 27/08/2018 5:05 PM, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) wrote:
If anyone is interested I have an unused Proscend 180T (from Duxtel originally) for sale. Contact me off list.
On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 at 11:03, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote:
Did you ever test yours ? I've not had a the chance. Not being able to get any stats about the link out of its turned me off. Mike
I don't have FTTN but of course got no use out of it on ADSL because of the fixed table VCI/VPI issue. I agree a lack of visibility on it's internal workings is indeed a deficit but not a show-stopper. I can't use it with any clients on the NBN so I have no need for it. I have deployed a 180R/C pair with great performance and reliability so far. On Mon, 27 Aug 2018 at 17:41, Mike O'Connor <mike@oeg.com.au> wrote:
On 27/08/2018 5:05 PM, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) wrote:
If anyone is interested I have an unused Proscend 180T (from Duxtel originally) for sale. Contact me off list.
On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 at 11:03, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote:
Did you ever test yours ? I've not had a the chance. Not being able to get any stats about the link out of its turned me off.
Mike
I've had mine running quite a few months now. Initially it was REALLY annoying - HAD to be plugged in after my CRS109 was powered on and booted, otherwise it never passed traffic. And would stop passing traffic about every 3 weeks.. Required you to remove and re-plug the SFP twice to get it back working. Turned out to be a RouterOS version issue - once I upgraded (that was fun.. Didn't realise they changed the way vlans were handled in the middle of 6.x, and completely broke my home network..) to latest version, it's been rock solid for a few months now. The lack of being able to pull line stats is really annoying though. There's talk in the tik forums of some windows app that talks raw ethernet frames to the SFP and can pull stats, but noone has produced a copy of it for anyone to be able to reverse engineer the protocol as yet.. I live in hope.. On 27 August 2018 at 17:41, Mike O'Connor <mike@oeg.com.au> wrote:
On 27/08/2018 5:05 PM, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) wrote:
If anyone is interested I have an unused Proscend 180T (from Duxtel originally) for sale. Contact me off list.
On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 at 11:03, Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) < jason@upandrunningtech.com.au> wrote:
Did you ever test yours ? I've not had a the chance. Not being able to get any stats about the link out of its turned me off.
Mike
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
-- Damien Gardner Jnr VK2TDG. Dip EE. GradIEAust rendrag@rendrag.net - http://www.rendrag.net/ -- We rode on the winds of the rising storm, We ran to the sounds of thunder. We danced among the lightning bolts, and tore the world asunder
participants (8)
-
Andrew Gilbett -
Damien Gardner Jnr -
Jason Hecker (Up & Running Tech) -
Mike Everest -
Mike O'Connor -
Paul Julian -
Philip Loenneker -
Thomas Jackson