Hi everyone I'm designing a network for a large accommodation facility. It'll have an office/conference hall containing the server room and 8 houses (mixture of 1, 2 and 3 storey). Later on they'll add numerous small units at the other end of the site. My thoughts were to use an AxiomTek NA850 (http://axiomtek.com/Default.aspx?MenuId=Products&FunctionId=ProductView&ItemId=1152&upcat=233) with 3x 4 port 10GbE running RouterOS as the main switch, a CCR1016-12S-1S+ as a secondary (so we've still got 1Gbps if the 10Gbps fails, but cheaper than 2x 10Gbps switches). I'd put CRS226-24G-2S+RMs in each of the buildings. The site will have NBN. It's a non-profit organisation so I don't think they'll go for enterprise fibre. Might go for multiple NBN links, not so much for redundancy but to separate voice and data etc. When they build the second stage, I was going to have a half height rack somewhere with another CCR1016-12S-1S+, and that connecting to either CRS125-24G-1S-RMs, or perhaps wall mount RB2011's or similar. My questions: . Will I get wirespeed switching at 1Gbps on the CCR, and at 10Gbps on the NA850? It'd be a dual Xeon with as much RAM as I need to specify. . What should I use a router? Perhaps a CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+? The bypass feature of the RB1100AHx2 was interesting (and the AxiomTek's have a bypass feature too) but I'm not sure how much cpu power I need. The site is a day's drive from me, so it needs to be reliable. There's people onsite who can handle things like swapping out a power supply (as long as I've got a way of detecting a failed one). Regards Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO
Hi Russell, First of all hello your name rang a bell and I looked back and noticed you were starting up a business and sent through a list of capabilities to my colleague sam kendall. In response to your questions, It feels like there's something missing from here. What is the internal 10Gbit requirement? This deployment would traditionally be handled predominately via switching and not routing(or bridging) so it seems a little strange. I wouldn't recommend a CCR or an x86 for what you describe as it's limited by software and would give you an overhead and potential issues that you may not need to have at all. If you're just chasing a multi-tenant serving for IP + other services to those houses + extras it might be able to be achieved by a pair of affordable switches + pair of rb1100's. Kind regards, RJ Plummer Director -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Russell Hurren Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 2:17 PM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: [MT-AU Public] Network design Hi everyone I'm designing a network for a large accommodation facility. It'll have an office/conference hall containing the server room and 8 houses (mixture of 1, 2 and 3 storey). Later on they'll add numerous small units at the other end of the site. My thoughts were to use an AxiomTek NA850 (http://axiomtek.com/Default.aspx?MenuId=Products&FunctionId=ProductView&ItemId=1152&upcat=233) with 3x 4 port 10GbE running RouterOS as the main switch, a CCR1016-12S-1S+ as a secondary (so we've still got 1Gbps if the 10Gbps fails, but cheaper than 2x 10Gbps switches). I'd put CRS226-24G-2S+RMs in each of the buildings. The site will have NBN. It's a non-profit organisation so I don't think they'll go for enterprise fibre. Might go for multiple NBN links, not so much for redundancy but to separate voice and data etc. When they build the second stage, I was going to have a half height rack somewhere with another CCR1016-12S-1S+, and that connecting to either CRS125-24G-1S-RMs, or perhaps wall mount RB2011's or similar. My questions: . Will I get wirespeed switching at 1Gbps on the CCR, and at 10Gbps on the NA850? It'd be a dual Xeon with as much RAM as I need to specify. . What should I use a router? Perhaps a CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+? The bypass feature of the RB1100AHx2 was interesting (and the AxiomTek's have a bypass feature too) but I'm not sure how much cpu power I need. The site is a day's drive from me, so it needs to be reliable. There's people onsite who can handle things like swapping out a power supply (as long as I've got a way of detecting a failed one). Regards Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
Hi RJ That's right - Sam and I have a couple of mutual friends. My initial thoughts when I was first given the drawings were the same as yours, but the project has been on hold for over a year and there's more options available than there used to be. I started looking at 10GbE equipment after having a conversation with a colleague who suggested that we might need it. The site will have a combination of short and long term guests, and I want to ensure that they can use any room as an office if necessary, so we'll have Ethernet to each room and wireless access points in the ceilings or walls. I want to make sure there's enough bandwidth as their requirements increase (eg, when the NBN gets faster, they start asking for video conferencing etc). They probably don't need 10GbE right now, but I want to give them the option. I'd looked at the CRS212-1G-10S-1S+IN, but there's quite a few comments on the forum saying that it overheats when it's loaded with SFP modules. I'm familiar with RouterOS, and being able to use it throughout simplifies management, but ultimately I'll use what they need and not use Mikrotik out of brand loyalty. Regards Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of RJ Plummer Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 14:54 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design Hi Russell, First of all hello your name rang a bell and I looked back and noticed you were starting up a business and sent through a list of capabilities to my colleague sam kendall. In response to your questions, It feels like there's something missing from here. What is the internal 10Gbit requirement? This deployment would traditionally be handled predominately via switching and not routing(or bridging) so it seems a little strange. I wouldn't recommend a CCR or an x86 for what you describe as it's limited by software and would give you an overhead and potential issues that you may not need to have at all. If you're just chasing a multi-tenant serving for IP + other services to those houses + extras it might be able to be achieved by a pair of affordable switches + pair of rb1100's. Kind regards, RJ Plummer Director -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Russell Hurren Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 2:17 PM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: [MT-AU Public] Network design Hi everyone I'm designing a network for a large accommodation facility. It'll have an office/conference hall containing the server room and 8 houses (mixture of 1, 2 and 3 storey). Later on they'll add numerous small units at the other end of the site. My thoughts were to use an AxiomTek NA850 (http://axiomtek.com/Default.aspx?MenuId=Products&FunctionId=ProductView&ItemId=1152&upcat=233) with 3x 4 port 10GbE running RouterOS as the main switch, a CCR1016-12S-1S+ as a secondary (so we've still got 1Gbps if the 10Gbps fails, but cheaper than 2x 10Gbps switches). I'd put CRS226-24G-2S+RMs in each of the buildings. The site will have NBN. It's a non-profit organisation so I don't think they'll go for enterprise fibre. Might go for multiple NBN links, not so much for redundancy but to separate voice and data etc. When they build the second stage, I was going to have a half height rack somewhere with another CCR1016-12S-1S+, and that connecting to either CRS125-24G-1S-RMs, or perhaps wall mount RB2011's or similar. My questions: . Will I get wirespeed switching at 1Gbps on the CCR, and at 10Gbps on the NA850? It'd be a dual Xeon with as much RAM as I need to specify. . What should I use a router? Perhaps a CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+? The bypass feature of the RB1100AHx2 was interesting (and the AxiomTek's have a bypass feature too) but I'm not sure how much cpu power I need. The site is a day's drive from me, so it needs to be reliable. There's people onsite who can handle things like swapping out a power supply (as long as I've got a way of detecting a failed one). Regards Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
It would be hard pressed for that scenario to even scrape 1Gbit per house, unless you have local services you're looking Like Greg said, maybe a pair of 24 port cisco 2960-x or juniper ex2200 with stacking (even utilising something like a 4x1gbit group for the stack) and a pair of rb1100's or ccr1009's for the router sounds like it would be sufficient. The hardware cost would probably be in the vicinity of $10k which would no doubt come close to the axiomtek unit combo you initially mention but would give you far greater hardware redundancy and I'd say much better performance - not to mention nicer administration. -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Russell Hurren Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 3:50 PM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design Hi RJ That's right - Sam and I have a couple of mutual friends. My initial thoughts when I was first given the drawings were the same as yours, but the project has been on hold for over a year and there's more options available than there used to be. I started looking at 10GbE equipment after having a conversation with a colleague who suggested that we might need it. The site will have a combination of short and long term guests, and I want to ensure that they can use any room as an office if necessary, so we'll have Ethernet to each room and wireless access points in the ceilings or walls. I want to make sure there's enough bandwidth as their requirements increase (eg, when the NBN gets faster, they start asking for video conferencing etc). They probably don't need 10GbE right now, but I want to give them the option. I'd looked at the CRS212-1G-10S-1S+IN, but there's quite a few comments on the forum saying that it overheats when it's loaded with SFP modules. I'm familiar with RouterOS, and being able to use it throughout simplifies management, but ultimately I'll use what they need and not use Mikrotik out of brand loyalty. Regards Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of RJ Plummer Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 14:54 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design Hi Russell, First of all hello your name rang a bell and I looked back and noticed you were starting up a business and sent through a list of capabilities to my colleague sam kendall. In response to your questions, It feels like there's something missing from here. What is the internal 10Gbit requirement? This deployment would traditionally be handled predominately via switching and not routing(or bridging) so it seems a little strange. I wouldn't recommend a CCR or an x86 for what you describe as it's limited by software and would give you an overhead and potential issues that you may not need to have at all. If you're just chasing a multi-tenant serving for IP + other services to those houses + extras it might be able to be achieved by a pair of affordable switches + pair of rb1100's. Kind regards, RJ Plummer Director -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Russell Hurren Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 2:17 PM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: [MT-AU Public] Network design Hi everyone I'm designing a network for a large accommodation facility. It'll have an office/conference hall containing the server room and 8 houses (mixture of 1, 2 and 3 storey). Later on they'll add numerous small units at the other end of the site. My thoughts were to use an AxiomTek NA850 (http://axiomtek.com/Default.aspx?MenuId=Products&FunctionId=ProductView&ItemId=1152&upcat=233) with 3x 4 port 10GbE running RouterOS as the main switch, a CCR1016-12S-1S+ as a secondary (so we've still got 1Gbps if the 10Gbps fails, but cheaper than 2x 10Gbps switches). I'd put CRS226-24G-2S+RMs in each of the buildings. The site will have NBN. It's a non-profit organisation so I don't think they'll go for enterprise fibre. Might go for multiple NBN links, not so much for redundancy but to separate voice and data etc. When they build the second stage, I was going to have a half height rack somewhere with another CCR1016-12S-1S+, and that connecting to either CRS125-24G-1S-RMs, or perhaps wall mount RB2011's or similar. My questions: . Will I get wirespeed switching at 1Gbps on the CCR, and at 10Gbps on the NA850? It'd be a dual Xeon with as much RAM as I need to specify. . What should I use a router? Perhaps a CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+? The bypass feature of the RB1100AHx2 was interesting (and the AxiomTek's have a bypass feature too) but I'm not sure how much cpu power I need. The site is a day's drive from me, so it needs to be reliable. There's people onsite who can handle things like swapping out a power supply (as long as I've got a way of detecting a failed one). Regards Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
As a bare minimum, I need a fibre switch with 8 fibre ports plus whatever ports it needs to connect to the router(s), so the CRS212-1G-10S-1S+IN would have seemed suitable if it was rack mounted and didn't have such bad reviews. The CRS226 has the annoying feature that only one of the SFP+ ports can operate at 1GB - the other is 10GB only, so if I want a redundancy, I either have to throw in media converters or use something different altogether in the houses. I'll have a look at the options - Cisco, Juniper, Brocade etc. The one thing they all seem to have in common is their websites don't make it easy to find what you're looking for. Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of RJ Plummer Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 16:07 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design It would be hard pressed for that scenario to even scrape 1Gbit per house, unless you have local services you're looking Like Greg said, maybe a pair of 24 port cisco 2960-x or juniper ex2200 with stacking (even utilising something like a 4x1gbit group for the stack) and a pair of rb1100's or ccr1009's for the router sounds like it would be sufficient. The hardware cost would probably be in the vicinity of $10k which would no doubt come close to the axiomtek unit combo you initially mention but would give you far greater hardware redundancy and I'd say much better performance - not to mention nicer administration. -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Russell Hurren Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 3:50 PM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design Hi RJ That's right - Sam and I have a couple of mutual friends. My initial thoughts when I was first given the drawings were the same as yours, but the project has been on hold for over a year and there's more options available than there used to be. I started looking at 10GbE equipment after having a conversation with a colleague who suggested that we might need it. The site will have a combination of short and long term guests, and I want to ensure that they can use any room as an office if necessary, so we'll have Ethernet to each room and wireless access points in the ceilings or walls. I want to make sure there's enough bandwidth as their requirements increase (eg, when the NBN gets faster, they start asking for video conferencing etc). They probably don't need 10GbE right now, but I want to give them the option. I'd looked at the CRS212-1G-10S-1S+IN, but there's quite a few comments on the forum saying that it overheats when it's loaded with SFP modules. I'm familiar with RouterOS, and being able to use it throughout simplifies management, but ultimately I'll use what they need and not use Mikrotik out of brand loyalty. Regards Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of RJ Plummer Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 14:54 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design Hi Russell, First of all hello your name rang a bell and I looked back and noticed you were starting up a business and sent through a list of capabilities to my colleague sam kendall. In response to your questions, It feels like there's something missing from here. What is the internal 10Gbit requirement? This deployment would traditionally be handled predominately via switching and not routing(or bridging) so it seems a little strange. I wouldn't recommend a CCR or an x86 for what you describe as it's limited by software and would give you an overhead and potential issues that you may not need to have at all. If you're just chasing a multi-tenant serving for IP + other services to those houses + extras it might be able to be achieved by a pair of affordable switches + pair of rb1100's. Kind regards, RJ Plummer Director -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Russell Hurren Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 2:17 PM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: [MT-AU Public] Network design Hi everyone I'm designing a network for a large accommodation facility. It'll have an office/conference hall containing the server room and 8 houses (mixture of 1, 2 and 3 storey). Later on they'll add numerous small units at the other end of the site. My thoughts were to use an AxiomTek NA850 (http://axiomtek.com/Default.aspx?MenuId=Products&FunctionId=ProductView&ItemId=1152&upcat=233) with 3x 4 port 10GbE running RouterOS as the main switch, a CCR1016-12S-1S+ as a secondary (so we've still got 1Gbps if the 10Gbps fails, but cheaper than 2x 10Gbps switches). I'd put CRS226-24G-2S+RMs in each of the buildings. The site will have NBN. It's a non-profit organisation so I don't think they'll go for enterprise fibre. Might go for multiple NBN links, not so much for redundancy but to separate voice and data etc. When they build the second stage, I was going to have a half height rack somewhere with another CCR1016-12S-1S+, and that connecting to either CRS125-24G-1S-RMs, or perhaps wall mount RB2011's or similar. My questions: . Will I get wirespeed switching at 1Gbps on the CCR, and at 10Gbps on the NA850? It'd be a dual Xeon with as much RAM as I need to specify. . What should I use a router? Perhaps a CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+? The bypass feature of the RB1100AHx2 was interesting (and the AxiomTek's have a bypass feature too) but I'm not sure how much cpu power I need. The site is a day's drive from me, so it needs to be reliable. There's people onsite who can handle things like swapping out a power supply (as long as I've got a way of detecting a failed one). Regards Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
The CRS212-1G-10S-1S+IN units come with rackmount ears in the box. :) (Sadly the CRS112'S do not have the rack ears, and I have quite a few of them!). I have two of these CRS212 units(fully loaded with sfp's) at work. They have been online for a couple of weeks beta testing( for pure internet distribution), and running a mix of 1Gbps SFP's(SM & MM links) in as a 'master-port / slave' arrangement passing trunks. Today was my 1st day back @ work after a short xmas break and one of two the units needed to be rebooted as 1 of the sfp's decided to stop talking(erratic to no pings) to another building(RB260GSP @ other side via fiber) the Disable/Enable didn't cut it, so a reboot fixed it. Hopefully they will keep fine tuning the firmware&routerOS to sort those kinds of issues! I've got a CRS125 in production(9 months) and its not under a huge load(<100Mbps AV forwarding traffic total) but this unit has never missed a beat.(That said I've also got a 1100AHx2 & RB1200, and they have been solid too running ~ 10 - 250Mbps of forwarding & routing & fire-walling). Finding appropriate gear can be a quite time consuming process. Its always worth asking on forums for opinions on gear for given scenarios. Cheers Greg On 30/12/2015 7:27 PM, Russell Hurren wrote:
As a bare minimum, I need a fibre switch with 8 fibre ports plus whatever ports it needs to connect to the router(s), so the CRS212-1G-10S-1S+IN would have seemed suitable if it was rack mounted and didn't have such bad reviews. The CRS226 has the annoying feature that only one of the SFP+ ports can operate at 1GB - the other is 10GB only, so if I want a redundancy, I either have to throw in media converters or use something different altogether in the houses.
I'll have a look at the options - Cisco, Juniper, Brocade etc. The one thing they all seem to have in common is their websites don't make it easy to find what you're looking for.
Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of RJ Plummer Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 16:07 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design
It would be hard pressed for that scenario to even scrape 1Gbit per house, unless you have local services you're looking
Like Greg said, maybe a pair of 24 port cisco 2960-x or juniper ex2200 with stacking (even utilising something like a 4x1gbit group for the stack) and a pair of rb1100's or ccr1009's for the router sounds like it would be sufficient. The hardware cost would probably be in the vicinity of $10k which would no doubt come close to the axiomtek unit combo you initially mention but would give you far greater hardware redundancy and I'd say much better performance - not to mention nicer administration.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Russell Hurren Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 3:50 PM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design
Hi RJ
That's right - Sam and I have a couple of mutual friends.
My initial thoughts when I was first given the drawings were the same as yours, but the project has been on hold for over a year and there's more options available than there used to be. I started looking at 10GbE equipment after having a conversation with a colleague who suggested that we might need it.
The site will have a combination of short and long term guests, and I want to ensure that they can use any room as an office if necessary, so we'll have Ethernet to each room and wireless access points in the ceilings or walls. I want to make sure there's enough bandwidth as their requirements increase (eg, when the NBN gets faster, they start asking for video conferencing etc). They probably don't need 10GbE right now, but I want to give them the option.
I'd looked at the CRS212-1G-10S-1S+IN, but there's quite a few comments on the forum saying that it overheats when it's loaded with SFP modules. I'm familiar with RouterOS, and being able to use it throughout simplifies management, but ultimately I'll use what they need and not use Mikrotik out of brand loyalty.
Regards
Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of RJ Plummer Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 14:54 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design
Hi Russell,
First of all hello your name rang a bell and I looked back and noticed you were starting up a business and sent through a list of capabilities to my colleague sam kendall.
In response to your questions, It feels like there's something missing from here. What is the internal 10Gbit requirement? This deployment would traditionally be handled predominately via switching and not routing(or bridging) so it seems a little strange. I wouldn't recommend a CCR or an x86 for what you describe as it's limited by software and would give you an overhead and potential issues that you may not need to have at all.
If you're just chasing a multi-tenant serving for IP + other services to those houses + extras it might be able to be achieved by a pair of affordable switches + pair of rb1100's.
Kind regards, RJ Plummer Director
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Russell Hurren Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 2:17 PM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: [MT-AU Public] Network design
Hi everyone
I'm designing a network for a large accommodation facility. It'll have an office/conference hall containing the server room and 8 houses (mixture of 1, 2 and 3 storey). Later on they'll add numerous small units at the other end of the site.
My thoughts were to use an AxiomTek NA850 (http://axiomtek.com/Default.aspx?MenuId=Products&FunctionId=ProductView&ItemId=1152&upcat=233) with 3x 4 port 10GbE running RouterOS as the main switch, a CCR1016-12S-1S+ as a secondary (so we've still got 1Gbps if the 10Gbps fails, but cheaper than 2x 10Gbps switches). I'd put CRS226-24G-2S+RMs in each of the buildings. The site will have NBN. It's a non-profit organisation so I don't think they'll go for enterprise fibre. Might go for multiple NBN links, not so much for redundancy but to separate voice and data etc.
When they build the second stage, I was going to have a half height rack somewhere with another CCR1016-12S-1S+, and that connecting to either CRS125-24G-1S-RMs, or perhaps wall mount RB2011's or similar.
My questions: . Will I get wirespeed switching at 1Gbps on the CCR, and at 10Gbps on the NA850? It'd be a dual Xeon with as much RAM as I need to specify. . What should I use a router? Perhaps a CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+? The bypass feature of the RB1100AHx2 was interesting (and the AxiomTek's have a bypass feature too) but I'm not sure how much cpu power I need.
The site is a day's drive from me, so it needs to be reliable. There's people onsite who can handle things like swapping out a power supply (as long as I've got a way of detecting a failed one).
Regards
Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
Thanks Greg I've had quite a while to think about this project (it's been on hold for a while waiting for finance) and new things are always becoming available. They haven't started building yet, so I've still got time to do more research. I've got 5x CRS125's and a CRS109 in the field and they've never missed a beat, but I guess the downside of using Mikrotik gear is that we have to do more research and testing before deploying it. I'm still happy with that - my clients will get something I've researched and tested thoroughly and get good value, and not just the same expensive Cisco box that everyone else uses (unless the Cisco really is the right choice for their situation). After the brief bit of research I did this afternoon, I'm thinking maybe a pair of Cisco 3750X-12S-S's - 12 port fibre switch. Cheaper option would be to connect to a pair of CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+ (and connect the CCR's together by 10GbE). More expensive option would be to add 10GbE uplinks to the 3750X and use a CCR1036-8G-2S+. I guess that'd be worth it if I need to do much inter-vlan routing, but otherwise probably not as we're limited by the Internet speed anyway. Regards Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Greg Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 18:49 To: public@talk.mikrotik.com.au Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design The CRS212-1G-10S-1S+IN units come with rackmount ears in the box. :) (Sadly the CRS112'S do not have the rack ears, and I have quite a few of them!). I have two of these CRS212 units(fully loaded with sfp's) at work. They have been online for a couple of weeks beta testing( for pure internet distribution), and running a mix of 1Gbps SFP's(SM & MM links) in as a 'master-port / slave' arrangement passing trunks. Today was my 1st day back @ work after a short xmas break and one of two the units needed to be rebooted as 1 of the sfp's decided to stop talking(erratic to no pings) to another building(RB260GSP @ other side via fiber) the Disable/Enable didn't cut it, so a reboot fixed it. Hopefully they will keep fine tuning the firmware&routerOS to sort those kinds of issues! I've got a CRS125 in production(9 months) and its not under a huge load(<100Mbps AV forwarding traffic total) but this unit has never missed a beat.(That said I've also got a 1100AHx2 & RB1200, and they have been solid too running ~ 10 - 250Mbps of forwarding & routing & fire-walling). Finding appropriate gear can be a quite time consuming process. Its always worth asking on forums for opinions on gear for given scenarios. Cheers Greg On 30/12/2015 7:27 PM, Russell Hurren wrote:
As a bare minimum, I need a fibre switch with 8 fibre ports plus whatever ports it needs to connect to the router(s), so the CRS212-1G-10S-1S+IN would have seemed suitable if it was rack mounted and didn't have such bad reviews. The CRS226 has the annoying feature that only one of the SFP+ ports can operate at 1GB - the other is 10GB only, so if I want a redundancy, I either have to throw in media converters or use something different altogether in the houses.
I'll have a look at the options - Cisco, Juniper, Brocade etc. The one thing they all seem to have in common is their websites don't make it easy to find what you're looking for.
Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of RJ Plummer Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 16:07 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design
It would be hard pressed for that scenario to even scrape 1Gbit per house, unless you have local services you're looking
Like Greg said, maybe a pair of 24 port cisco 2960-x or juniper ex2200 with stacking (even utilising something like a 4x1gbit group for the stack) and a pair of rb1100's or ccr1009's for the router sounds like it would be sufficient. The hardware cost would probably be in the vicinity of $10k which would no doubt come close to the axiomtek unit combo you initially mention but would give you far greater hardware redundancy and I'd say much better performance - not to mention nicer administration.
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Russell Hurren Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 3:50 PM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design
Hi RJ
That's right - Sam and I have a couple of mutual friends.
My initial thoughts when I was first given the drawings were the same as yours, but the project has been on hold for over a year and there's more options available than there used to be. I started looking at 10GbE equipment after having a conversation with a colleague who suggested that we might need it.
The site will have a combination of short and long term guests, and I want to ensure that they can use any room as an office if necessary, so we'll have Ethernet to each room and wireless access points in the ceilings or walls. I want to make sure there's enough bandwidth as their requirements increase (eg, when the NBN gets faster, they start asking for video conferencing etc). They probably don't need 10GbE right now, but I want to give them the option.
I'd looked at the CRS212-1G-10S-1S+IN, but there's quite a few comments on the forum saying that it overheats when it's loaded with SFP modules. I'm familiar with RouterOS, and being able to use it throughout simplifies management, but ultimately I'll use what they need and not use Mikrotik out of brand loyalty.
Regards
Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of RJ Plummer Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 14:54 To: MikroTik Australia Public List <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design
Hi Russell,
First of all hello your name rang a bell and I looked back and noticed you were starting up a business and sent through a list of capabilities to my colleague sam kendall.
In response to your questions, It feels like there's something missing from here. What is the internal 10Gbit requirement? This deployment would traditionally be handled predominately via switching and not routing(or bridging) so it seems a little strange. I wouldn't recommend a CCR or an x86 for what you describe as it's limited by software and would give you an overhead and potential issues that you may not need to have at all.
If you're just chasing a multi-tenant serving for IP + other services to those houses + extras it might be able to be achieved by a pair of affordable switches + pair of rb1100's.
Kind regards, RJ Plummer Director
-----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Russell Hurren Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 2:17 PM To: 'MikroTik Australia Public List' <public@talk.mikrotik.com.au> Subject: [MT-AU Public] Network design
Hi everyone
I'm designing a network for a large accommodation facility. It'll have an office/conference hall containing the server room and 8 houses (mixture of 1, 2 and 3 storey). Later on they'll add numerous small units at the other end of the site.
My thoughts were to use an AxiomTek NA850 (http://axiomtek.com/Default.aspx?MenuId=Products&FunctionId=ProductView&ItemId=1152&upcat=233) with 3x 4 port 10GbE running RouterOS as the main switch, a CCR1016-12S-1S+ as a secondary (so we've still got 1Gbps if the 10Gbps fails, but cheaper than 2x 10Gbps switches). I'd put CRS226-24G-2S+RMs in each of the buildings. The site will have NBN. It's a non-profit organisation so I don't think they'll go for enterprise fibre. Might go for multiple NBN links, not so much for redundancy but to separate voice and data etc.
When they build the second stage, I was going to have a half height rack somewhere with another CCR1016-12S-1S+, and that connecting to either CRS125-24G-1S-RMs, or perhaps wall mount RB2011's or similar.
My questions: . Will I get wirespeed switching at 1Gbps on the CCR, and at 10Gbps on the NA850? It'd be a dual Xeon with as much RAM as I need to specify. . What should I use a router? Perhaps a CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+? The bypass feature of the RB1100AHx2 was interesting (and the AxiomTek's have a bypass feature too) but I'm not sure how much cpu power I need.
The site is a day's drive from me, so it needs to be reliable. There's people onsite who can handle things like swapping out a power supply (as long as I've got a way of detecting a failed one).
Regards
Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com. au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com. au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com. au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com. au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com. au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
Russell I think you need to divide up what requires 'ROUTING' and what requires 'SWITCHING' to narrow down equipment. You should also describe what kind of traffic you expect and services required(Internet/ access control / CCTV / Voice /Internal corporate network/ etc...) all of which may all translate into requirements for VLAN segments running over trunks Consider the anticipated average and burst traffic levels especially for backbones. Consider your options for redundancy between network devices vs cost and complexity to manage. You should also note limits on physical cabling distances, if as you say they will possibly expand cat5e/6 has a limit of 90meters and allow for 5/5meters of patch cabling on either end. If they expand then you need to make sure you dont need to rip all the old gear out and start again.. Fiber optic is defiantly worth it for backbone trunks, especially when your talking 10Gbps and above and you want reliability, long distances and future proofing. Cost is getting very reasonable for 6 to 12 core indoor 50uM OM3 and outdoor fiber. Consider hardware other than Mikrotik for pure switching(EG. Cisco 2960's), as you will find when running a CRS226/CRS125's that once end users are pushing 1Gbps+ traffic through the unit you will need to ensure you are using the 'switch chip' functionality of those models rather than relying on the CPU side of RouterOS to move layer 2 frames as CPU load will soon reach 100%(those units don't have overly fast CPU's) and of course depending on traffic load. Other reasons to look at other hardware is the lack of 802.1x support in MT on the physical ports and port security in general(e.g Guests plug in all sorts of random crap into ether ports in there rooms, e.g rouge DHCP servers, there own AP's, monitoring equipment etc.., so you need a plan..!). Good luck <http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&ved=0ahUKEwijyeDjhoPKAhUG4qYKHRTND2AQjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cisco.com%2Fc%2Fen%2Fus%2Ftd%2Fdocs%2Fsolutions%2FEnterprise%2FSecurity%2FSAFE_RG%2FSAFE_rg%2Fchap5.html&psig=AFQjCNHV71Rk4rTvprN0VQ00T9-a63g-EA&ust=1451546630282279> Regards Greg. On 30/12/2015 5:16 PM, Russell Hurren wrote:
Hi everyone
I'm designing a network for a large accommodation facility. It'll have an office/conference hall containing the server room and 8 houses (mixture of 1, 2 and 3 storey). Later on they'll add numerous small units at the other end of the site.
My thoughts were to use an AxiomTek NA850 (http://axiomtek.com/Default.aspx?MenuId=Products&FunctionId=ProductView&ItemId=1152&upcat=233) with 3x 4 port 10GbE running RouterOS as the main switch, a CCR1016-12S-1S+ as a secondary (so we've still got 1Gbps if the 10Gbps fails, but cheaper than 2x 10Gbps switches). I'd put CRS226-24G-2S+RMs in each of the buildings. The site will have NBN. It's a non-profit organisation so I don't think they'll go for enterprise fibre. Might go for multiple NBN links, not so much for redundancy but to separate voice and data etc.
When they build the second stage, I was going to have a half height rack somewhere with another CCR1016-12S-1S+, and that connecting to either CRS125-24G-1S-RMs, or perhaps wall mount RB2011's or similar.
My questions: . Will I get wirespeed switching at 1Gbps on the CCR, and at 10Gbps on the NA850? It'd be a dual Xeon with as much RAM as I need to specify. . What should I use a router? Perhaps a CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+? The bypass feature of the RB1100AHx2 was interesting (and the AxiomTek's have a bypass feature too) but I'm not sure how much cpu power I need.
The site is a day's drive from me, so it needs to be reliable. There's people onsite who can handle things like swapping out a power supply (as long as I've got a way of detecting a failed one).
Regards
Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
Thanks Greg I've discussed the cabling with the contractor who's building it, and the plan is to run 6 core fibre between the buildings. There's a small workshop where we can put a half-height cabinet, and we'll run fibre to there as part of the initial build, and then we can run from there to each of the units when they're built later. We will need VLANs - we'll have VoIP, internal network, guest network. Not sure about CCTV/access control yet. With CRS125/226's I can use the switch chip and port/mac based vlans and use isolation to prevent people broadcasting dhcp to everyone else etc, but I'm open to considering other options too. At the core - looks like it might make sense to use something else for switching. Regards Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO -----Original Message----- From: Public [mailto:public-bounces@talk.mikrotik.com.au] On Behalf Of Greg Sent: Wednesday, 30 December 2015 15:47 To: public@talk.mikrotik.com.au Subject: Re: [MT-AU Public] Network design Russell I think you need to divide up what requires 'ROUTING' and what requires 'SWITCHING' to narrow down equipment. You should also describe what kind of traffic you expect and services required(Internet/ access control / CCTV / Voice /Internal corporate network/ etc...) all of which may all translate into requirements for VLAN segments running over trunks Consider the anticipated average and burst traffic levels especially for backbones. Consider your options for redundancy between network devices vs cost and complexity to manage. You should also note limits on physical cabling distances, if as you say they will possibly expand cat5e/6 has a limit of 90meters and allow for 5/5meters of patch cabling on either end. If they expand then you need to make sure you dont need to rip all the old gear out and start again.. Fiber optic is defiantly worth it for backbone trunks, especially when your talking 10Gbps and above and you want reliability, long distances and future proofing. Cost is getting very reasonable for 6 to 12 core indoor 50uM OM3 and outdoor fiber. Consider hardware other than Mikrotik for pure switching(EG. Cisco 2960's), as you will find when running a CRS226/CRS125's that once end users are pushing 1Gbps+ traffic through the unit you will need to ensure you are using the 'switch chip' functionality of those models rather than relying on the CPU side of RouterOS to move layer 2 frames as CPU load will soon reach 100%(those units don't have overly fast CPU's) and of course depending on traffic load. Other reasons to look at other hardware is the lack of 802.1x support in MT on the physical ports and port security in general(e.g Guests plug in all sorts of random crap into ether ports in there rooms, e.g rouge DHCP servers, there own AP's, monitoring equipment etc.., so you need a plan..!). Good luck <http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&ved=0ahUKEwijyeDjhoPKAhUG4qYKHRTND2AQjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cisco.com%2Fc%2Fen%2Fus%2Ftd%2Fdocs%2Fsolutions%2FEnterprise%2FSecurity%2FSAFE_RG%2FSAFE_rg%2Fchap5.html&psig=AFQjCNHV71Rk4rTvprN0VQ00T9-a63g-EA&ust=1451546630282279> Regards Greg. On 30/12/2015 5:16 PM, Russell Hurren wrote:
Hi everyone
I'm designing a network for a large accommodation facility. It'll have an office/conference hall containing the server room and 8 houses (mixture of 1, 2 and 3 storey). Later on they'll add numerous small units at the other end of the site.
My thoughts were to use an AxiomTek NA850 (http://axiomtek.com/Default.aspx?MenuId=Products&FunctionId=ProductView&ItemId=1152&upcat=233) with 3x 4 port 10GbE running RouterOS as the main switch, a CCR1016-12S-1S+ as a secondary (so we've still got 1Gbps if the 10Gbps fails, but cheaper than 2x 10Gbps switches). I'd put CRS226-24G-2S+RMs in each of the buildings. The site will have NBN. It's a non-profit organisation so I don't think they'll go for enterprise fibre. Might go for multiple NBN links, not so much for redundancy but to separate voice and data etc.
When they build the second stage, I was going to have a half height rack somewhere with another CCR1016-12S-1S+, and that connecting to either CRS125-24G-1S-RMs, or perhaps wall mount RB2011's or similar.
My questions: . Will I get wirespeed switching at 1Gbps on the CCR, and at 10Gbps on the NA850? It'd be a dual Xeon with as much RAM as I need to specify. . What should I use a router? Perhaps a CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+? The bypass feature of the RB1100AHx2 was interesting (and the AxiomTek's have a bypass feature too) but I'm not sure how much cpu power I need.
The site is a day's drive from me, so it needs to be reliable. There's people onsite who can handle things like swapping out a power supply (as long as I've got a way of detecting a failed one).
Regards
Russell Hurren Managing Director Zero Point Networks PTY LTD (08) 6262 ZERO _______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com. au
_______________________________________________ Public mailing list Public@talk.mikrotik.com.au http://talk.mikrotik.com.au/mailman/listinfo/public_talk.mikrotik.com.au
participants (3)
-
Greg -
RJ Plummer -
Russell Hurren